Pack your bags Roy

[danperkins]

This is the Hodgson blueprint

I don't disagree with that. He doens't seem happy with the personnel and i think we all can see we are lacking in wide areas, this is something i hope that is remedied in January, please god.

For the moment Roy has a bit of leeway, he has bought himself that. Lets see how he goes about it.

[Scratch]

I agree with you that you sometimes need to increase your attacking threat. I dont agree that rafa didnt seek to win. I just think that HE thought that the best way of trying to win was different to what you and i think it was.

Ah, but do you think that Rafa set out to win every game tho, which is where my argument with Arn originally stemmed from? Did he leave at the end of each draw bemoaning the fact that we hadn't come away with three points, or happy to have snatched a point?

[kris90210]

Not really, because our team when we played them in 2005, was vastly inferior to that which we have now.

Sitting on the edge of your own box for 45 mins is potentially suicidal, whichever way you look at it. Smaller clubs do it because they have an inferiority complex which tells them they cant set up higher up the park because they'll leave space behind and get destroyed. We're not a club or team of that ilk, though. Unfortunately, as a manager, it's all Roy's been used to, which explains why we're doing it. He needs to snap out of it though.

Coming into yesterdays match, our team was vastly inferior. We're going over old ground now, but Chelsea having been pissing over everyone. 27 goals (is it?) and 3 conceded in 10 premiership games? That's a frigging incredible stat. By contrast, our form has been so poor that we were in the relegation zone just over a week ago.

We had a tough match on Thursday and lost a couple of defenders at short notice during the build up to the game. We had Meireles playing right mid and Maxi on the left! Kelly making his first premiership start (I was surprised at that) - up against one of the best wingers in the league.

I do agree with you on Hodgson though. The jury is very much out. But I find it a bit distastful that people would seek to discredit him on the back of a fantastic performance.

Give him **** when he says stupid things, makes bad decisions, and results don't go his way. But it has to work both ways. He's due credit here.

[Lecter]

Sorry, but i think this is rubbish. Even **** players can score an easy tap in, if the right ball drops to them in front of goal. If nothing else, an attacking player or striker would have the instinct to be in the right place at the right time, more so than Mascherano would.

The thing is the play is congested and compressed

You look at those games on average you'd have 8 opposition playrs playing narrow and deep plus our attacking players

Best way isnt to pile players into the box / area where it is suggested its to either provide width or movement to shift the opposition around

Those players we had didnt do enough of either of those things

[danperkins]

It was widely accepted that Rafa's problems last season came mostly from things out of his realm & which were mostly imposed onto him (I don't think I need to go into all of the details for you to understand what I mean). Who else was available to him apart from Lucas & Mascherano? Spearing & the convalescent Aquilani?

I hear ya mate but then he did buy Aquilani and spend so much money on Johnson, so i can't accept that our problems came form things outside of his control. Rafa and the players underperformed, and in the end the manager takes the responsibility for players he signed and the match results, just as Roy has.

[Craig_H]

More men in the box it just makes the play congested even more

If it was different players I'd gladly accept the point but essentially you are saying bodies in the box = goals and I'm not convinced of that. You cant just pluck someone out of the crowd (lets call him Voronin) and put him in the box and say that would equate to goals

Now if you were bringing on an attacking player that provided movement, a bit of guile and craft then yes I'd be all for it but we werent

IF that season we had someone like Garcia coming off from the bench I reckon we might have just nicked that league but unfortunately we didnt so I'm none too convinced of that argument I can understand the sentiment behind your thoughts and scratches but in reality I dont see it having that much of an impact

Sorry Lec, but you know as well as i do, that if you put more bodies in the box (for a cross, for example) then the opposition defence has more to think about, more to worry about and less of an easy ride. That's simple.

And whatever you may think of Voronin, to comparison to picking someone out of the crowd, is daft as well. In the context of 'the random man from a crowd' situation, Voronin is obviously a vastly better footballer/finisher/goalscorer than this random bloke would be.

You dont need to be a quality striker to stick the ball in the net from 6 yards, if it drops to you with half a second of time. And in terms of 2008-2009, we had Keane on the bench to bring on - he wasnt great, but he was good enough to take an 'easy' chance if it came his way.

By not putting bodies in the box, we reduced the percentage of this happening for us. United do the opposite, and they get late winners quite a lot of the time.

You may put this down to coincidence, but it's clearly not. Unless you're going to tell me that people like Bebe are 'quality' attackers.

[DannyMan2006]

In fairness to both Rafa and Roy they have had to piece a team together from a pretty limited squad. I'm not convinced Rafa did as well as he could have in the transfer Market, but most of the blame must go the G+H.

I think Rafa would have created a fine team given the right funding. I also think we'll look better under Roy if we get the right players in. A striker to partner/switch with Torres is essential. Follow that up with a real quality left sided winger and we could be looking good.

Whilst Hodgsons tactics will continue to remain more negative than we'd like, we are starting to look more solid - only two conceded in the last five games - and if we can keep this up what we then require is players capable of unlocking a tight defence.

We lacked those players under Rafa and of course we still lack them now. What ever system you play you still need players of high quality who can break down the opposition. We need to get away from being so self reliant on Torres and Gerrard.

[kris90210]

In fairness to both Rafa and Roy they have had to piece a team together from a pretty limited squad. I'm not convinced Rafa did as well as he could have in the transfer Market, but most of the blame must go the G+H.

I think Rafa would have created a fine team given the right funding. I also think we'll look better under Roy if we get the right players in. A striker to partner/switch with Torres is essential. Follow that up with a real quality left sided winger and we could be looking good.

Whilst Hodgsons tactics will continue to remain more negative than we'd like, we are starting to look more solid - only two conceded in the last five games - and if we can keep this up what we then require is players capable of unlocking a tight defence.

We lacked those players under Rafa and of course we still lack them now. What ever system you play you still need players of high quality who can break down the opposition. We need to get away from being so self reliant on Torres and Gerrard.

Well said

[danperkins]

In fairness to both Rafa and Roy they have had to piece a team together from a pretty limited squad. I'm not convinced Rafa did as well as he could have in the transfer Market, but most of the blame must go the G+H.

I think Rafa would have created a fine team given the right funding. I also think we'll look better under Roy if we get the right players in. A striker to partner/switch with Torres is essential. Follow that up with a real quality left sided winger and we could be looking good.

Whilst Hodgsons tactics will continue to remain more negative than we'd like, we are starting to look more solid - only two conceded in the last five games - and if we can keep this up what we then require is players capable of unlocking a tight defence.

We lacked those players under Rafa and of course we still lack them now. What ever system you play you still need players of high quality who can break down the opposition. We need to get away from being so self reliant on Torres and Gerrard.

A balanced and fair post

I'm happy enough at the moment, delighted with recent results and improving performances, albeit not concrete. But without jumping the gun, as a manager and as a team we seem to be moving in the right direction. Will it last? I dunno but i'll take it at the moment anyways.

P.S.Think we had 18 points at this stage last season so not that bad, considering we've played lot of the top teams in the league already.

[Craig_H]

Ah, but do you think that Rafa set out to win every game tho, which is where my argument with Arn originally stemmed from? Did he leave at the end of each draw bemoaning the fact that we hadn't come away with three points, or happy to have snatched a point?

I just typed out a whole long reply to this and somehow, i pressed something and it ****ing disappeared

I think rafa set out to achieve what was required from each game, depending on our situation at the time. And i dont think he's alone in doing it that way.

Eg, if you have 2 games left and need 4 pts to win the title - your 37th game is Spurs away and your 38th is West Ham at home, i would be going into that Spurs game with avoiding defeat, as my first priority, without a doubt.

Obviously you seek to win and try to win, but i would be moving heaven and earth to make sure we didnt get beat - knowing full well that if offered a home game against WHU and knowing a win gives us the title, i would take that scenario every day of the week.

But you cant go into the WHU game and only need to win to get the title, if you firstly go and lose the Spurs game.

I think Rafa would've come away from some draws bemoaning 2 dropped points, and come away from others knowing that the single point we'd got, in combination with other points from 'easier' games, would come in very handy in helping us achieve our overall objectives.

[Craig_H]

Coming into yesterdays match, our team was vastly inferior. We're going over old ground now, but Chelsea having been pissing over everyone. 27 goals (is it?) and 3 conceded in 10 premiership games? That's a frigging incredible stat. By contrast, our form has been so poor that we were in the relegation zone just over a week ago.

We had a tough match on Thursday and lost a couple of defenders at short notice during the build up to the game. We had Meireles playing right mid and Maxi on the left! Kelly making his first premiership start (I was surprised at that) - up against one of the best wingers in the league.

I do agree with you on Hodgson though. The jury is very much out. But I find it a bit distastful that people would seek to discredit him on the back of a fantastic performance.

Give him **** when he says stupid things, makes bad decisions, and results don't go his way. But it has to work both ways. He's due credit here.

I totally disagree with that, i think coming into yesterday's game and facing a Chelsea side without Drogba, Essien and Lampard, meant that our starting XI wasnt at all inferior to their's.

[Craig_H]

The thing is the play is congested and compressed

You look at those games on average you'd have 8 opposition playrs playing narrow and deep plus our attacking players

Best way isnt to pile players into the box / area where it is suggested its to either provide width or movement to shift the opposition around

Those players we had didnt do enough of either of those things

I know it's congested and compressed, but that's where you combine bodies in the box, with a high tempo of play, and quick movement of the ball, and then the congestion seems a far less difficult barrier to overcome.

If a side has good numbers forward, and they're attacking with a high tempo and intensity, thus putting immense pressure on the opposition, the opposition defenders will struggle to retain their composure and will panic - leading to more mistakes and more chance to score.

[danperkins]

We had 33 points at the midway point last season, should be interesting to see how far Roy has come and how he is doing come to the end of the year.

[Lecter]

And in terms of 2008-2009, we had Keane on the bench to bring on - he wasnt great, but he was good enough to take an 'easy' chance if it came his way.
.

We only had Keane for 6 months... and I distinctly remember him missing a number of absolute sitters

[Craig_H]

We only had Keane for 6 months... and I distinctly remember him missing a number of absolute sitters

Of course he missed sitters, everyone does. The point is though, sitters came his way - and by their very nature, sitters are more often converted than missed.

So that in itself backs up my suggestion that putting more threatening/attacking players into the danger areas is more likely to result in chances to score.