Dejan Lovren

[Mark79]

It’s not a way of looking at it, it’s just reality. Top performers get much more leeway when they make mistakes.

That said, TAA does get plenty of criticism for his defending.

[labourRed]

This guy rarely gets any praise.

He was great today. He and big Virg were colossal handling everything thrown at them.

Aye, Matip walks back into the team but he's very solid. We've got some very decent CBs.

[Red_Polo]

It’s not a way of looking at it, it’s just reality. Top performers get much more leeway when they make mistakes.

That said, TAA does get plenty of criticism for his defending.

[dom9]

I'd say it's based on preconceptions, and in some cases, agendas.

You just know there's a whole pack of people waiting to pounce on Lovren for anything they can attribute to him ****ing up. I swear their furious anger actually makes them feel better.

[SB]

TAA gets a pass as he is 21 years old, contributes massively all over the pitch as a key part of our style of play and has time to develop defensively.

Lovren is a 30 year old centre half who literally has one job, defend.

When teams sit as deep as Palace did today our CB’s can start an attack with a piercing pass through the middle like Lovren can do & did today or the long diagonal ball to the wingers like Virge tends to do so I don’t go along with the premise that CB’s only have one job to do sorry.

[Mark79]

I can’t speak for everyone, but for me it’s based on how he’s performed for us over the past 5 years. He’s not the absolute disaster he was in his early days. But he can still be erratic, even in his better games.

[Mark79]

[/B]

When teams sit as deep as Palace did today our CB’s can start an attack with a piercing pass through the middle like Lovren can do & did today or the long diagonal ball to the wingers like Virge tends to do so I don’t go along with the premise that CB’s only have one job to do sorry.

I didn’t say that CB’s only have one job to do. I was making a specific comparison between 2 players. All Lovren has to do for people to be content with his performance is do the basics and not cock up. TAA, at 21, is already held to much higher standard and has much more expected of him than just being solid at the back.

[Buzzo]

I think the point Dom was making was of Lovren makes a mistake he gets loads of abuse whereas other players get a pass.

A mistake is a mistake.

[dom9]

I think the point Dom was making was of Lovren makes a mistake he gets loads of abuse whereas other players get a pass.

A mistake is a mistake.

Yep. Kind of.

I'd also expand to say that the word "supporter" includes the word "support".

Too many people just don't. They end up rabidly raving and baying for blood at the first opportunity when it comes to some players.

So rather than queuing up to put the boot in and shouting cunt at everyone that will listen, maybe just be a bit more grown up, civilised and measured in the critique?

I love watching toy throwing the meltdown at Arsenal right now.

We're better than that though surely? Best fans in the world and all that...

[danperkins]

I think the point Dom was making was of Lovren makes a mistake he gets loads of abuse whereas other players get a pass.

A mistake is a mistake.

it is a fair point.

Had this exact conversation yesterday without fellow red. He loves Trent and so do I but I don't think it is a stretch to say that he attacking game is a lot better than his defensive game. He is the epitome of a modern fullback and is outstanding going forward but does make a lot of defensive mistakes that sometimes are glossed over saying "what he provides going forward is so good that we can forgive a few defensive mistakes".

Am I a fan of Lovren? No, but he is not as car crash as he was. He should not be a starter when Matip is fit but he is a decent 4th choice CB. Unfortunately Matip is a bit of a crock so Dejan will get a lot of games. I would have thought Gomez would have pushed for that CB starting spot but he has looked pretty abysmal since coming back from injury. Also, another CB with a terrible injury record and his injuries have been really serious for one so young.

IMO Dejan will want to be a first 11 CB and might move on this summer. Matip I really like, our best defender this season imo but he does seem to pick up a lot of niggling injuries. I can see us going into the market for another CB in the summer.

[Mark79]

I think the point Dom was making was of Lovren makes a mistake he gets loads of abuse whereas other players get a pass.

A mistake is a mistake.

I know, I’ve given my reply on that to Dom.

Lovren has a history of costly mistakes. TAA, while not being perfect defensively, hasn’t. It also has to be taken in consideration how much TAA’s role means he is as much as winger/play maker as he is a defender.

An attacking full back getting caught out of position, losing his man, or losing possession trying to make something? It’s bound to happen.

A centre half doing the same? Not so excusable.

[Buzzo]

Players get better though right? Trent has since Klopp came in, so has Dejan. The only mistakes he has made since Klopp came in were v Spurs 3 years ago. I can’t think of any others that have cost us points.

Anyway, I knew posting that he’d had a good game would end up in this sort of chat.

[Red_Polo]

Anyway, I knew posting that he’d had a good game would end up in this sort of chat.

In fairness, that's only happened because someone agreeing with you has framed it this way by pulling another player down.

[dom9]

In fairness, that's only happened because someone agreeing with you has framed it this way by pulling another player down.

I haven't pulled TAA down. I've highlighted the glaring inconsistency in how the two players are assessed.

[Mark79]

Players get better though right? Trent has since Klopp came in, so has Dejan. The only mistakes he has made since Klopp came in were v Spurs 3 years ago. I can’t think of any others that have cost us points.

Anyway, I knew posting that he’d had a good game would end up in this sort of chat.

Spurs was 2 years ago. There was also Utd the same season.

More recently there was City in January this year.

Still not much in 2 years you say. Maybe, but he’s only made about 18 league starts since that Utd game.

To be fair, this chat only came about by (fair) criticism of TAA, not Lovren.