Newcastle (H) Monday Jan 1st

[Mark79]

I'd say we have a much better squad than we did 2 years ago and also in 2001. In terms of results, we certainly weren't impacted by the cups two years ago.

Stuff Arsenal, then go on and lift the trophy.

We were far less beset with injuries in each of those seasons compared to this one already though.

[Exiled_red]

I'd say we have a much better squad than we did 2 years ago and also in 2001. In terms of results, we certainly weren't impacted by the cups two years ago.

Stuff Arsenal, then go on and lift the trophy.

We were far less beset with injuries in each of those seasons compared to this one already though.

When we nearly went all the way yes we were less impacted by injuries but I think the squad was more mature and settled in knowing what it could and couldn't do, players were used to playing 2 games a week at the level and pace required, for me the current squad don't have that yet. Also I think that season and so much football did have a detrimental impact on the players in the longer term. While the quad is the ultimate dream I don’t think we are ready for it, and would much rather sacrifice on competition for the players not running themselves into the ground.

[RedReet]

We were far less beset with injuries in each of those seasons compared to this one already though.

But injuries are going to happen regardless. We've picked up these injuries despite rotating quite heavily. Plus players like Quansah, Endo, Tsimikas, Elliot, Gomez have benefitted from getting semi regular game time.

I get the logic there are potentially bigger fish to fry etc, but all season fans keep playing down our chances. We'll be lucky to finish top 4, but when challenging for title, it's only because we haven't payed anyone good. When we win it's normally because the opposition were poor. Keep hearing how certain players or tactics are going to get found out, but here we are after having played everyone. There is nothing to say that if we go out of cup we'll win anything else or that we'll definitely avoid certain injuries, so **** it, let's go for the quad.

Plus beating Arsenal away would be a psychological blow to them and untimately benefit us in the league IMO.

[RedReet]

When we nearly went all the way yes we were less impacted by injuries but I think the squad was more mature and settled in knowing what it could and couldn't do, players were used to playing 2 games a week at the level and pace required, for me the current squad don't have that yet. Also I think that season and so much football did have a detrimental impact on the players in the longer term. While the quad is the ultimate dream I don’t think we are ready for it, and would much rather sacrifice on competition for the players not running themselves into the ground.

We have almost a week before Arsenal, then we stop soon after for winter break. After that there are only 4 games before the final. I honesty don't think those 4 games will take a massive toll on our squad and the benefit of winning those games could easily be worth more than the extra rest.

Perfect example being the recent West Ham game.

[Mark79]

But injuries are going to happen regardless. We've picked up these injuries despite rotating quite heavily. Plus players like Quansah, Endo, Tsimikas, Elliot, Gomez have benefitted from getting semi regular game time.

I get the logic there are potentially bigger fish to fry etc, but all season fans keep playing down our chances. We'll be lucky to finish top 4, but when challenging for title, it's only because we haven't payed anyone good. When we win it's normally because the opposition were poor. Keep hearing how certain players or tactics are going to get found out, but here we are after having played everyone. There is nothing to say that if we go out of cup we'll win anything else or that we'll definitely avoid certain injuries, so **** it, let's go for the quad.

Plus beating Arsenal away would be a psychological blow to them and untimately benefit us in the league IMO.

My point was though that to challenge on all fronts, as we did in 2000/01 and 2021/22, you need to get off lightly with injuries. So you're able to make full use of your squad.and rotate to guard against fatigue as mich as possible.

This season we're already without a starting CB and both left backs. That's going to pit a big playing load on the likes of Joe Gomez. We've also been without Thiago and Bajcetic from the start. That's resulted in Mac Allister and Szoboszlai playing more frequently and more minutes to this point of a season than they've ever done before. And we've already seen that result in an injury and drop off in form in each of them respectively.

[Mark79]

When we nearly went all the way yes we were less impacted by injuries but I think the squad was more mature and settled in knowing what it could and couldn't do, players were used to playing 2 games a week at the level and pace required, for me the current squad don't have that yet. Also I think that season and so much football did have a detrimental impact on the players in the longer term. While the quad is the ultimate dream I don’t think we are ready for it, and would much rather sacrifice on competition for the players not running themselves into the ground.

Yep agree with this. Although I do think the squad was mostly ready and equipped for such a challenge, though I think we needed to rotate more in the domestic cups than we did.

[RedReet]

My point was though that to challenge on all fronts, as we did in 2000/01 and 2021/22, you need to get off lightly with injuries. So you're able to make full use of your squad.and rotate to guard against fatigue as mich as possible.

This season we're already without a starting CB and both left backs. That's going to pit a big playing load on the likes of Joe Gomez. We've also been without Thiago and Bajcetic from the start. That's resulted in Mac Allister and Szoboszlai playing more frequently and more minutes to this point of a season than they've ever done before. And we've already seen that result in an injury and drop off in form in each of them respectively.

But they have rarely started in the cups and Mac's injury was an impact one. If we were in CL, both players would have played more, so not sure you can blame the number of games.

I obviously understand your logic and should we lose to Arsenal, I'll be fully on board. Selfishly though, I want us to win everything and will take no comfort in losing to Arsenal, but bigger picture, I honestly think the upside of beating a rival and having a winning streak in the cup will be more beneficial to our greater ambitions.

[Mark79]

But they have rarely started in the cups and Mac's injury was an impact one. If we were in CL, both players would have played more, so not sure you can blame the number of games.

I obviously understand your logic and should we lose to Arsenal, I'll be fully on board. Selfishly though, I want us to win everything and will take no comfort in losing to Arsenal, but bigger picture, I honestly think the upside of beating a rival and having a winning streak in the cup will be more beneficial to our greater ambitions.

Szoboszlai has started 2 of our 3 LC games and they were both sandwiched in between him starting each of the 2 PL games a few days either side. I saw a stat saying he’s already reached 88% of his biggest season in terms of minutes played, and we’re not even half way through this one.

Mac Allister, yes you’re right that was an impact injury, though I’m sure he was taken off as a precautionary because of muscle tightness in one of the games just before the Sheffield Utd one, if I remember rightly.

[Exiled_red]

We have almost a week before Arsenal, then we stop soon after for winter break. After that there are only 4 games before the final. I honesty don't think those 4 games will take a massive toll on our squad and the benefit of winning those games could easily be worth more than the extra rest.

Perfect example being the recent West Ham game.

It's not just the game time, but more games means reduced rest and prep time for other games, and increased likelihood of injuries

[RedReet]

Szoboszlai has started 2 of our 3 LC games and they were both sandwiched in between him starting each of the 2 PL games a few days either side. I saw a stat saying he’s already reached 88% of his biggest season in terms of minutes played, and we’re not even half way through this one.

Mac Allister, yes you’re right that was an impact injury, though I’m sure he was taken off as a precautionary because of muscle tightness in one of the games just before the Sheffield Utd one, if I remember rightly.

He's started no EL games though and we didn't need to play him in the cup. Starting 20 games at this stage of the season is hardly a huge ask IMO.

Again, I fully understand the logic, but is the concern really warranted for 4 extra games? 4 games in a season when players have got a rare summer off, will get a rare winter break, have generally got a rare break in mid week games and all our injured players will have had an enforced rest?

The risk/downside just seems so low compared to all the potential positives.

[RedReet]

It's not just the game time, but more games means reduced rest and prep time for other games, and increased likelihood of injuries

Stats may prove me wrong and it may have been just one recent season in particular, but I'm fairly sure we had a spell when results were much worse when we had a full week to prepare.

Again though, I get the logic, but for 4 extra games, I just don't think it's worth sacrificing a major trophy when none of those concerns might even prove to be an issue.

[Mark79]

He's started no EL games though and we didn't need to play him in the cup. Starting 20 games at this stage of the season is hardly a huge ask IMO.

Again, I fully understand the logic, but is the concern really warranted for 4 extra games? 4 games in a season when players have got a rare summer off, will get a rare winter break, have generally got a rare break in mid week games and all our injured players will have had an enforced rest?

The risk/downside just seems so low compared to all the potential positives.

You don’t think the stat I mentioned is a huge increase in playing load? A break next summer has no benefits in terms of fatigue/freshness this season. He’s done the weekend/midweek/weekend sequence more than once this season as I already pointed out. And the flip side of players having enforced rest through injury is an increased playing load on the remaining fit players. Which in turn puts them at greater risk of fatigue or injury.

[RedReet]

You don’t think the stat I mentioned is a huge increase in playing load? A break next summer has no benefits in terms of fatigue/freshness this season. He’s done the weekend/midweek/weekend sequence more than once this season as I already pointed out. And the flip side of players having enforced rest through injury is an increased playing load on the remaining fit players. Which in turn puts them at greater risk of fatigue or injury.

I don't know. I don't know why he didn't play much in those seasons when a few weeks ago he looked like Superman who could play 3 games a day every day of the week. Why didn't he play more, why should I be concerned that he's played a normal amount of games this season?

The other point I forgot to make in my last post was the monitoring of payers by club doctors before every game, if our main players are even selected to play. This is surely more relevant than how many games our players played in previous seasons?

Anyway, we are just going around in circles here. You don't mind if we go out of the FA Cup for the reasons you mentioned and I disagree.

[Mark79]

I don't know. I don't know why he didn't play much in those seasons when a few weeks ago he looked like Superman who could play 3 games a day every day of the week. Why didn't he play more, why should I be concerned that he's played a normal amount of games this season?

The other point I forgot to make in my last post was the monitoring of payers by club doctors before every game, if our main players are even selected to play. This is surely more relevant than how many games our players played in previous seasons?

Anyway, we are just going around in circles here. You don't mind if we go out of the FA Cup for the reasons you mentioned and I disagree.

Regarding your other point. Increases in playing load is definitely relevant but also something we've taken risks on before, only for it to backfire catastrophically. See Bajcetic last season.

If you think I'm saying I don't mind if we go out to Arsenal, then I'm not sure you've followed what I been saying. My point all along has been that in order to compete on all fronts, you need a favouable wind on the injury front.

[Mark79]

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