Clattenburg

[red g]

Cheeky Monkey would have been a dreadful choice of words, and I just cannot see how he would have said it. Maybe if it was a 1950s Carry On Film, but a PL match between Chelsea and Man Utd, not a chance. If he said it, it was racist.

I don't think it was, You just don't use the word Cheeky and Monkey together to create a rascist term at all.

[CJ]

is it ok to say ragamuffin?

[Vermilion]

I don't think it was, You just don't use the word Cheeky and Monkey together to create a rascist term at all.

It's not about creating a known racist phrase though is it ?

It's more about the fact two people were in a dispute/argument, one black one white, and the white person decides to use the term 'monkey' in a sentence, why ? was it just him using a known english phrase, or did he choose that phrase because he knew it would wind Mikel up ? in which case it becomes racist abuse.

[McDermotX]

We don't know if he said Cheeky monkey?

But if he did it wouldn't have been racial not a chance.

I wouldn't even go down the 'doesn't matter about context' road with that, even after all the Suarez ****e.

[TheElephantMan]

I think what we learned from the Suarez case is that intent is irrelevant. Whether the offender means to cause offence or not doesn't matter. If the victim feels that he has been abused then it is abuse.

[Lee]

I just can't understand why Clattenburg would call Mikel a 'cheeky monkey'.

You call children that, adults don't call eachother that. Seems a bit strange.

If he did say it, of course.

[Tee]

I just can't understand why Clattenburg would call Mikel a 'cheeky monkey'.

You call children that, adults don't call eachother that. Seems a bit strange.

If he did say it, of course.

Totally agree. Racism aside, it just doesn't seem like the kind of language used in that environment does it?

[baitman]

what was the stage of the game when clat spoke with mikel... was he booking him or sumfin. maybe mikel was trying to blow smoke up clats arse, so he then says dont be a cheeky monkey, as if telling a kid off...

[Lee]

Totally agree. Racism aside, it just doesn't seem like the kind of language used in that environment does it?

Definitely mate.

It makes no sense to use it in that way. I also find it hard to believe that a referee would insult someone anyway - racist remarks or anything.

[fred_plasticine]

seriously?

yes, seriously. because that's what a racists do these day: they use terms that are in itself absolutely fine but can be racist in the context they're used. next step is to protest your innocence and shock at being labeled a racist and blame the victim for "playing the race card".

[BobTheCharmer]

yes, seriously. because that's what a racists do these day:

the swines, I hanker for the good old days when racists were racists and proud of it.

[Warren]

So from this thread I have now deduced that Clattenburg maybe, definitely, probably didn't say Cheeky monkey/monkey/ Spanish **** to Mikel/Mata and that Refs should be treated as they are in Rugby and that I should never call any of my kids a cheeky monkey as that is now a racist term! FFS

[McDermotX]

I just can't understand why Clattenburg would call Mikel a 'cheeky monkey'.

You call children that, adults don't call eachother that. Seems a bit strange.

If he did say it, of course.

Totally agree. Racism aside, it just doesn't seem like the kind of language used in that environment does it?

I don't know lads.............first things first, I think it's jumping the gun without knowing exactly what was said so this could spiral out of control before the facts are known. Something that we should be careful of considering what happened last year.
As for the phrase 'cheeky monkey' being out of place in the refereeing world.....I'm not convinced of that either. It's certainly something you'd imagine the likes of David Ellerey using in the past in an overbearing, condescending manner when talking down to players. Something that happens quite often with officials when attempting to put players in their place......I know I heard similar phrases being barked in my direction way back when.
But ultimately, we don't know what Clattenberg's character is.........it might well be a facet of his personality when dealing with spoiled, argumentative footballers......or it might not. We just don't know.
To call 'cheeky monkey' a common phrase, is doing it a real disservice.......Christ, I must have heard it half a dozen times recently!

If people want to play the context card, because that's what was held against Luis, that's fine........if it can be proven, then by precedent set, they will have to act against Clattenberg, but that doesn't make it the correct course of action and certainly doesn't make it right.
You would hope everyone has learned a lesson from the mistakes of the past and try to rise above petty vindictiveness with what may very well be an innocent encounter in a highly-charged atmosphere.

I tell you what.....after all the recent high-horsing from various commentators about how to handle racial abuse and discrimination, t-shirt wearing, PFA plans and how best to move forward in the future.......a completely unnecessary charge brought against what might well be joke evidence of racism would be a huge backstep, which would could have massive implications in future accusations.

Was brought up enough times during Luis' case, as a case for how out of touch the FA and PL are.....but how do you think a court would react to somebody calling someone else 'cheeky monkey' ?

I really think everyone should just wait to see what comes from a report made into the complaint.

[baitman]

good post, McDx

i reckon that the chavs have only shouted racist cheeky monkey cos they feel so hard done to by the manure fa ref being too biased towards gills boss dbf.

there are just so many levels that could be corrupt there is no clear line of right and wrong any more. football is now ****ed. its going to take a thorough overhaul to remove the bias and prejudice from this game

[Kenneth]

yes, seriously. because that's what a racists do these day: they use terms that are in itself absolutely fine but can be racist in the context they're used. next step is to protest your innocence and shock at being labeled a racist and blame the victim for "playing the race card".

Wow, these modern racists sound sly as foxes with their MO of double entrendre racist slurs.