The Prem, is it a Top4 or Top3,

[Mattshark]

No we are not. We're looking to finish 3rd at best.

Bollocks, we are clearly still in the title race. You may claim to not be doom and gloom, but the above post is pure pessimism.

[carheex]

No we are not. We're looking to finish 3rd at best.

If we did finish 3rd, I'd be pretty happy with that. In the scheme of things, it would have to be classed as an achievement. And I wouldn't class that as a negative thing to say either - the club is nowhere near the echelons of the 70s and 80s and the sooner we ALL realise that the better. Half of the fans seem to accept that 3rd/4th/5th is about our level at the moment but half still think, somewhat bizarrely, that we should be challenging for or winning the league just because we used to a few decades ago. Unfortunately, that leaves 50% of our fans disappointed and airing negative feeling toward the club just because of their own unrealistic expectations.

[Jazzmaster]

Bollocks, we are clearly still in the title race. You may claim to not be doom and gloom, but the above post is pure pessimism.

No its not. I want to win the title, but i dont think we will. Thats not pessimism just realism. We dont have sufficient quality in the team. If you ask anyone that is not an LFC supporter if they think we have a chance of winning the title and I guarantee 100% of them will say no. 100%.

[carheex]

Bollocks, we are clearly still in the title race. You may claim to not be doom and gloom, but the above post is pure pessimism.

In that case, which teams would you say are NOT in the title race? and would you base that on mathematics, previous title winning form, betting odds, pure sentiment, or some other subjective criteria?

[Kopite_Colin]

Until

1) the manager stops buying 2nd rate quantity over 1st rate quality in attacking areas
2) G & H release the monies for him to be able to do this
3) the manager stops rotating and consistently plays his strongest 11

we won't win the league - whoever the manager is

The only way to avoid 1) and 2) above is for us to start producing good young talent from within the club and that's at least 3-5 years away to have a significant impact on the 1st 11.

[Nic83]

Top 4. only 4 teams have ANY chance. The others have a better chance than us though. But it won't be a shock if we were to win it

[carheex]

What's your signature all about?

[Nic83]

In that case, which teams would you say are NOT in the title race? and would you base that on mathematics, previous title winning form, betting odds, pure sentiment, or some other subjective criteria?

I'd base it on the fact that their players aren't good enough to claw back that many points. Ours are. Well i should say our squad is as 1 or 2 players obviously don't fit that criteria.

[donpisci]

I don't fundamentally disagree about who has proven themselves capable of winning the title, but it's still a question of timescale and definitios to suit as in -

If we are not one of the Big 4, how come we finsihed above one of the others for the past 2 years (and may well do again this year)? Why is 'won the title in the past 5 years' a criteron - change it to last 3 years, and Arsenal no longer qualify, nor did ManU last year? CL qualfication is what defines the 'Big 4' and consistently acheiving that makes you one - but if it's about winning stuff, our CL performances make us an even bigger club. As the others are also targetting CL glory as well, less succesfully than us, we have to be counted as Big 4, even if we have yet to prove it by winning the League recently.

There is even an argument that the other 3 are now really more interested in CL than PL - hence Mourinho's sacking, and one of the reasons Arsenal recruted Wenger in the first place. But what makes me laugh - somewht nervously - is the way Utd/Hacks are spinning the line that Fergie has set overhauling our 18 as his target before retiring, when for years the line has been that he was determined to win the CL again - which failure will extend to 10 years if he doesn't do it this year.

OK, I'm desperate for the league, and acknowledge that we are still falling a bit short (although Rafa is, imho, still, by some way,the best option we have to get there), but I resent the way others -and sometimes some of our own - use selective memory and pernicious revisionism to dismiss or denigrate our standing and status.

Very good post

We are a top 4 side and I still think we stand a chance of winning the league, however unlikely it may be.
At the beginning of the season, when we were palying our best football of the year, we totally outclassed Chelsea, who are considered to be capable of winning the league, only to be robbed by the ref. Against Arsenal, they couldn't beat us despite us being in the middle of our bad run and we were poor against Utd, but still should have had a draw. This shows that we are a match for any of the 3 team above us.

I know we haven't got a point away from home against these 3 since Rafa started, but that run has to end sometime...so why not now?

Win our games in hand and we are 7 points behind Arsenal, 6 Utd and 1 behind Chelsea (i think). We are still very much in the race.

[carheex]

But it won't be a shock if we were to win it

you're mental.

[Armchairkopite]

We can still win it, its an outside chance i know but realisticly we can still win the league if we can keep our main players (Reina,Finnan,Carra,Agger,Kewell,Marsh,Alonso,Gerr ard,Benni,Torres,Kuyt and Aurellio) fit.

It wont be easy but we are capable of doing it.

[Mattshark]

No its not. I want to win the title, but i dont think we will. Thats not pessimism just realism. We dont have sufficient quality in the team. If you ask anyone that is not an LFC supporter if they think we have a chance of winning the title and I guarantee 100% of them will say no. 100%.

No it is pessimism, deal with it, with have a chance, we are not far off the top, the difference is not insumountable. And I guarentee you are wrong with the second point, because there are people on here who think we have chance, sorry.

[Nic83]

We can still win it, its an outside chance i know but realisticly we can still win the league if we can keep our main players (Reina,Finnan,Carra,Agger,Kewell,Marsh,Alonso,Gerr ard,Benni,Torres,Kuyt and Aurellio) fit.

It wont be easy but we are capable of doing it.

In fairness, we'd have a better chance of winning it if Kuyt wasn't fit. Crouchy would give us a WAY better chance up there with El Nino!

[carheex]

I'd base it on the fact that their players aren't good enough to claw back that many points. Ours are. Well i should say our squad is as 1 or 2 players obviously don't fit that criteria.

You can only say our players are capable of doing it when they've proved they can do it....surely?

[Morten_nogamst_Pedersen]

Well said, how anyone can disagree with that i'll never know.
Some fans need a reality check. I used to be one of them.
The United game at home was the game were it hit home that we're just not up to it, maybe it's a mental block, maybe it's just a lack of quality in certain areas, who knows but at the end of the day we're just not good enough to be in the title race.

Is it such a good point as many says? What about 6-7 years ago, when we beat the mancs 4-5 times on the row.
Remember Riise cracker match, Gerrard cracker match, Spud being match winner 3 times if I rememper correctly. We were as far off the top back then, except that one season we finished 2nd.
I think the manc match could have ended both ways, if we'd been a tad more luckier than the mancs were.