Lucas and the evaluation of players performance

[Mattshark]

good appointment in my opinion.

At least we'll see some decent football - **** knows what he'll make of lucas though.

Probably a good midfielder who's stats don't remotely fit the accusations thrown at him by some "fans".

[el matador]

Probably a good midfielder who's stats don't remotely fit the accusations thrown at him by some "fans".

You need to take the blinkers off mate and take a look at his overall ability and technique.

Does he have the right attributes to play in pellegrini's pass, pass, move pass style. you just need to look at the midfielders that played at villareal under his stewardship - senna, pires, cazorla - all really good technical players.

Lucas did a job under benitez but if pellegrini comes in then the focus will change from catenaccio to tactics orientated towards attacking and opening teams up.

We need a new skill set to play this type of football and I dont think some of our players have it. Lucas is one of them but he isnt the only one.

[Mattshark]

You need to take the blinkers off mate and take a look at his overall ability and technique.

Does he have the right attributes to play in pellegrini's pass, pass, move pass style. you just need to look at the midfielders that played at villareal under his stewardship - senna, pires, cazorla - all really good technical players.

Lucas did a job under benitez but if pellegrini comes in then the focus will change from catenaccio to tactics orientated towards attacking and opening teams up.

We need a new skill set to play this type of football and I dont think some of our players have it. Lucas is one of them but he isnt the only one.

His ability and technique are very good, he rarely gives the ball away and he is a good passer, he basically got vilified for simply not being Alonso.

[Kenneth]

His ability and technique are very good, he rarely gives the ball away and he is a good passer, he basically got vilified for simply not being Alonso.

He's a distinctly average passer on a par with dozens of players in the PL. He was vilified for being **** but improved last season. Ok asa square player, but if he plays as many games under the new manager as he did for Rafa then our midfield will be secerly limited.

[wiw]

This isn't a Lucas thread

[Craig_H]

Probably a good midfielder who's stats don't remotely fit the accusations thrown at him by some "fans".

Do we have to rate every Liverpool player to be real fans?

[Mattshark]

He's a distinctly average passer on a par with dozens of players in the PL. He was vilified for being **** but improved last season. Ok asa square player, but if he plays as many games under the new manager as he did for Rafa then our midfield will be secerly limited.

He is a good passer though, he passing is very good.

No he wasn't, he was one of our best players last season and was constantly criticised for things that were not shown to be true through his stats (backwards and sideways passing for example).

[Mattshark]

Do we have to rate every Liverpool player to be real fans?

Those who booed him aren't, they are scum.

It is also a little different when the criticism comes around things that are blatantly false.

[Craig_H]

Those who booed him aren't, they are scum.

It is also a little different when the criticism comes around things that are blatantly false.

I agree about booing.

Blatantly false in your opinion.

So basically, either people rate him, or they're not proper fans.

[Mattshark]

I agree about booing.

Blatantly false in your opinion.

So basically, either people rate him, or they're not proper fans.

Not really, passing backwards etc - shown to be false
Average passer - His passing accuracy is very good, this is born out from statistics too
Not being Alonso - Pretty ridiculous, not being judged on his own merits.

[Craig_H]

Not really, passing backwards etc - shown to be false
Average passer - His passing accuracy is very good, this is born out from statistics too
Not being Alonso - Pretty ridiculous, not being judged on his own merits.

It's a statement of opinion, not fact.

Obviously he doesnt ALWAYS pass backwards and sideways, but some people might think that he doesnt play advanced signficant forward passes on a consistent basis. That's their perogative, if they hold this view.

Someone for whom a high percentage of passes are short, easy, sideways or backwards passes, WILL have a high passing accuracy percentage.

Likewise, they might feel that he doesnt do enough in their opinion, to be much more than an average-decent player.

Again, they're entitled to this opinion.

But you apparently think that if they hold this opinion, they arent proper Liverpool fans. Which is a load of bollocks.

[Kenneth]

And he didn't get booed as such. People booed Rafa's substitution, which is still not on, and relates to their opinion of Lucas, but not the same as saying Lucas was booed.

[Mattshark]

It's a statement of opinion, not fact.

Obviously he doesnt ALWAYS pass backwards and sideways, but some people might think that he doesnt play advanced signficant forward passes on a consistent basis. That's their perogative, if they hold this view.

Someone for whom a high percentage of passes are short, easy, sideways or backwards passes, WILL have a high passing accuracy percentage.

Likewise, they might feel that he doesnt do enough in their opinion, to be much more than an average-decent player.

Again, they're entitled to this opinion.

But you apparently think that if they hold this opinion, they arent proper Liverpool fans. Which is a load of bollocks.

Actually no Craig, it is an opinion and subjective

Two issues there though Craig.
It has been clearly shown that he doesn't just pass backwards and sideways many times on here, so that can't account for his passing statistics (which like his tackling are some of the best in the league).

[kris90210]

Stats can be misleading. I remember Biscan had better passing stats than Alonso in his first season according to opta.

I think Lucas is decent. Stats have their place but you only have to watch him play for us to realise that he is / has been fairly limited. Would be interesting to see how he would do under a different manager

[Craig_H]

Actually no Craig, it is an opinion and subjective

Two issues there though Craig.
It has been clearly shown that he doesn't just pass backwards and sideways many times on here, so that can't account for his passing statistics (which like his tackling are some of the best in the league).

As i said, a lot of his passes are short, 5 yard balls which will obviously have a positive impact on his passing accuracy stats. Stats dont always tell the story though.

Tell me, do Liverpool fans have to rate every Liverpool player, in order to be proper fans?

Are there any Liverpool players who you dont think are brilliant/very good etc, and dont rate?