Citeh build up (1st leg semi)

[Exiled_red]

I thought it looked reckless. It's exactly the sort of challenge that it appears the people who rule the game have been looking to remove from the game. The problem for me is that , as usual, the regulation of them by referees has been inconsistent. In this instance though I don't think they are helped by players, commentators or supporters who contribute to a culture of acceptance (whether that is good or bad for the game).

[Exiled_red]

Yep. Meanwhile the worst "challenge" I've seen all season Cabaye on Jay Spearing is perfectly fine.

I think there is a big problem with inconsistencies between incidents seen and punished by the referee and what the referee misses or doesn't punish. It seems to come down to the willingness of the referees to admit they got it wrong or the FA to over-rule them.

I don't think there are too many incidents where the FA have over-ruled the referee. i.e. if a player receives a controversial red card it only gets overturned (in the majority of cases) if the referee admits he got it wrong, there are very few occasions where the FA will say that a referee got it wrong and overturn the decision.

Similarly if a player commits a bad foul that is worthy of a red card but the referee doesn't deem it so at the time the player gets away with it. This whole if the referee dealt with it the FA can't look into it for me is a problem.

I can see why the FA back referees it's a tough job and they don't want to undermine them as this will likely make their job even harder. But these issues do nothing for consistency of refereeing decisions in the game.

[Kenneth]

I thought it looked reckless. It's exactly the sort of challenge that it appears the people who rule the game have been looking to remove from the game. The problem for me is that , as usual, the regulation of them by referees has been inconsistent. In this instance though I don't think they are helped by players, commentators or supporters who contribute to a culture of acceptance (whether that is good or bad for the game).

I don't think that's true. There were a series of these:



and I believe the intention was primarily to cut them out. Two straight legs together. These are the leg breakers, not so much tackles where one foot is going for the target and the other follows with a sort of scissor motion.

[JHP]

That figure doesn't apply to cards.

True. The figure I quoted was from Stuart Gilhooly who said that in 2010/11 the FA had a conviction rate of 99.5%. But that did not include wrongful dismissal claims against red cards. Not sure what those figures are but I guess they're somewhat similar.

[pondus]

I think it's something like 0.05% of cases overall that are successful.

True. The figure I quoted was from Stuart Gilhooly who said that in 2010/11 the FA had a conviction rate of 99.5%. But that did not include wrongful dismissal claims against red cards. Not sure what those figures are but I guess they're somewhat similar.

99.5+0.05=99.55

[JHP]

99.5+0.05=99.55

I'm only an accountant If ever you want advice you know where to come.

[pondus]

I'm only an accountant

Aaah, I see. Poor guy..

[Cormack74]

Balotelli and Dzeko are doubts according to the beeb.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/16492841.stm

[SB]

Balotelli and Dzeko are doubts according to the beeb.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/16492841.stm

[Exiled_red]

Hopefully that's true.

[El Aguila Calva]

It was always going to be upheld IMO, two footed challenges are considered dangerous play to the letter of the law.

Good news for us anyway he was their best player in the league game.

I keep reading journos writing these same phrases, even whilst also quoting the actual laws of the game, which as far as I can see don't highlight two footed as being any worse than one footed. To the contrary they specifically group "using one or both legs" together when describing a "lunge".

Guardian yesterday:

By the letter of the law the Manchester City captain, Vincent Kompany, deserved to be sent off... it was two-footed and unnecessary. Ignore the fact that Kompany won the ball – referees are told not to take this into account. The guidelines for officials under law 12 of the Fifa rules states: "Any player who lunges at an opponent in challenging for the ball from the front, from the side or from behind using one or both legs, with excessive force and endangering the safety of an opponent is guilty of serious foul play."

Telegraph also yesterday:

Fifa's Laws of the Game state that: "Any player who lunges at an opponent in challenging for the ball from the front, from the side or from behind using one or both legs with excessive force and endangering the safety of an opponent is guilty of serious foul play. A player who is guilty of serious foul play should be sent off." So by the letter of the Law, whether Kompany made contact with Nani, or injured him, or won the ball, are irrelevant. He lunged with both feet off the ground, and therefore he had to be dismissed.

So the laws state that to have committed "serious foul play" you must have "lunged" (number of legs being irrelevant) using "excessive force" AND "endangering the safety of an opponent".

I can't see how Kompany's challenge qualifies. Surely it didn't meet both "excessive..." and "endangering..." criteria, did it? And if it did then I reckon they might as well just ban any tackle that involves going to ground because at least that would eliminate any inconsistency of opinion.

That's me finished for 2012, need to maintain my posts per year stat.

[Exiled_red]

I know where you are coming from, I think there is some simplification or interpretation of the rules applied by press/pundits/supporters. It seems to be generally accepted that a two footed challenge deserves a red card, whether this is an FA instruction or as a result of this simplification/interpretation of the rules I don't know.

Getting back to the rules I guess the 'excessive force' could come from having your whole weight behind the challenge (if you go in two footed), if you go in with one foot the weight of your body is through your standing foot. 'Endangering the safety of an opponent' is this the issue of not having control of your momentum if you go in two footed?

[Lecter]

Darryl (@RedLFCBlood)

Posted Tuesday 10th January 2012 from Twitlonger
@BrianDurand56 @briankettle @jd77 @GrkStav @ScouserLA @JimBoardman @Andrew_Heaton RT FA - Report regarding Kompany Another interesting twist in this story, Kompany's ban has been upheld by the FA, a four match ban for his challenge on Saturday, and I decided to read the FA Report. It seems that 8 of the 9-man panel thought it should be overturned, but they need a unanimous decision to overturn red cards. The one man who refused to overturn the red card? You've guessed it, none other than Denis Smith.

[Exiled_red]

Darryl (@RedLFCBlood)

Posted Tuesday 10th January 2012 from Twitlonger
@BrianDurand56 @briankettle @jd77 @GrkStav @ScouserLA @JimBoardman @Andrew_Heaton RT FA - Report regarding Kompany Another interesting twist in this story, Kompany's ban has been upheld by the FA, a four match ban for his challenge on Saturday, and I decided to read the FA Report. It seems that 8 of the 9-man panel thought it should be overturned, but they need a unanimous decision to overturn red cards. The one man who refused to overturn the red card? You've guessed it, none other than Denis Smith.

Firstly I'm surprised that a 9 man panel sits on this, secondly I'm surprised you need a unanimous decision, thirdly I'm surprised that 8 people wanted it overturned.

[Icon]

Suprising...