how we should approach the bus parkers

[Norbs]

To me the most essential part to change against deep lying teams is our midfield. We simply need players that can bring the ball forward better, and make more forward passes rather than sideways. The combination of Gini/Can against those teams just doesn't work IMO. It's great against aggressive/attacking teams because they break up the game well and hold it up well, but against bus teams we need something different. Henderson is a way better forward passer, but we need more than him back. Maybe moving Lallana back in central?

We don't have a lot of options, but something along those lines for me. That said, we did enough to win the game against Swansea, we just didn't finish the chances we got.

If it's the pace of attack that's the issue, then bringing the ball forward against a team with 11 behind the ball already is that it only creates even more congestion. A forward pass travels much quicker generally than a carried ball.

[Lecter]

I think in our current squad Lallana will be crucial to breaking these types of teams down. Without our creative spark gone in Phil, Lallana can work in tight spaces and pull teams out of their shape. I still feel we will miss someone Like Coutinho who can pick a killer pass out of nothing. Can, Gini, Milner & Henderson offer us nothing in a creative way and are essentially work horses, working in between transitions.

Lallana has tons of skill and ability no doubt about that, theres just a couple of things that dont make him an absolute top top player

The first one is a lack of pace / acceleration off the mark and secondly I sometimes feel he beats a man only to turn back and beat him again, and again

The lack of pace could be the reason he does the latter but even on Monday you saw him turn a guy inside out have space to either shoot or lay a ball off yet he chooses to turn back and try and beat the man again

[Lecter]

One other way of giving them the ball in dangerous areas is going longer and then pouncing on the second balls which we have players to do.

I’d like to see us try something tactically different.

I'd love to see the stats for how many 2nd balls we win

I bet they arent good reading

[Darkon]

If it's the pace of attack that's the issue, then bringing the ball forward against a team with 11 behind the ball already is that it only creates even more congestion. A forward pass travels much quicker generally than a carried ball.

I actually more meant for us to be able to break through before they get organized and 11 behind the ball. There is a very short room for that against teams like Swansea, and when we have the opportunity it's pretty useless that the ball get's stuck with midfielders that rarely makes passes that breaks lines.

When they're organised I'd argue that a player that can make a good forward pass can also make it sideways if necessary.

But particularly against Swansea, we would tbh. have been fine if we just finished our chances. We did plenty to win in reality, but in general I feel this is our biggest problem against bus parkers.

[baitman]

I'd love to see the stats for how many 2nd balls we win

I bet they arent good reading

if you could get the stats for the second balls we win in our box from set pieces we'd be drying. worse than ****e i'd bet.

[danperkins]

Lallana has tons of skill and ability no doubt about that, theres just a couple of things that dont make him an absolute top top player

The first one is a lack of pace / acceleration off the mark and secondly I sometimes feel he beats a man only to turn back and beat him again, and again

The lack of pace could be the reason he does the latter but even on Monday you saw him turn a guy inside out have space to either shoot or lay a ball off yet he chooses to turn back and try and beat the man again

Very talented guy but yeah not pacey or direct enough to ever to a top quality player. I like him though.

[RedReet]

Anyone else think this is all a bit knee jerk?

I mean, we've lost 5 games in 46 games across all competitions.

That's really not bad at all.

It was just a **** day at the office for all, let's move on and trash Huddersfield, WBA and Spurs.

Not at all. You are only as good as your last match. Doesn't matter that we beat them 5-0 a few weeks ago with basically the same team and forget that the same attack put 4 past City, Klopp should have shown Swansea more respect and completely changed the formation and line-up for this one. It was obvious. That's the arrogance of Klopp though and illustrates why we'll never win anything under him. Imagine thinking that that same team that was on a long unbeaten run and just beaten the soon to be champions were good enough to beat Swansea.

How does it go? Oh yes, we are in decline...

[BG1973]

I'd love to see the stats for how many 2nd balls we win

I bet they arent good reading

And I bet the stats would improve were it a deliberate tactic.

[Lecter]

And I bet the stats would improve were it a deliberate tactic.

Not by much

We dont have the players who have the desire to win 2nd balls

If we had them we would concede less goals from set pieces as virtually all the goals we concede from set pieces are not off the initial ball but 2nd balls

If you cant compete for the 2nd ball within your own box then chances are you aint gonna compete for it higher up the pitch

[Lecter]

if you could get the stats for the second balls we win in our box from set pieces we'd be drying. worse than ****e i'd bet.

Yep and remember thats one of the most important places to win them

We are utter ****e at competing for 2nd balls and have been for quite some time

[Roboklopp]

Well Lallana is out for the next game so it’s gonna continue being an issue.


(My phone just changed continue to coutinho- how apt )

[Fosterbloke]

A few more risky vertical passes at pace or overloading the wings and putting in low crosses into runners.

[BG1973]

Not by much

We dont have the players who have the desire to win 2nd balls

If we had them we would concede less goals from set pieces as virtually all the goals we concede from set pieces are not off the initial ball but 2nd balls

If you cant compete for the 2nd ball within your own box then chances are you aint gonna compete for it higher up the pitch

I should clarify..

I mean even if we don’t win the second ball, they will have the ball in their own third with our players putting them under pressure.

Which is where we can be very dangerous - not passing the ball around in front of them.

[baitman]

I should clarify..

I mean even if we don’t win the second ball, they will have the ball in their own third with out players putting them under pressure.

Which is where we can be very dangerous - not passing the ball around in front of them.

if we were putting more men in the final third between the opposition defensive lines and we were to vary our play to include going wide and cutting back or the odd semi-long ball we know we would not maintain possession but its then an opportunity to put the pressure on the other team because now they will have the ball...

its not often a high ball into the box from wide will be useful as a direct goal threat as they will have all their big defensive lumps in there, but we would then be better placed to gain the second ball right in their goal area.
our little midgets would meg them for fun.

[BigChief]

A few more risky vertical passes at pace or overloading the wings and putting in low crosses into runners.

the more time the ball spends on or a few feet around the penalty spot the more liklihood something will happen. Whether that's via high balls that the defenders keep winning or low crosses the defenders keep clearing it doesn't matter. Passing it around outside the penalty area and in our own half four 70 minutes is exactly what they want and we don't.

Vvd is fast and strong enough to cover any breaks they may wish to go on. In fact the oppos breaking on us is what we want to open space.