Jürgen Klopp

[frank the tank]

Look at what most people predicted for us and I'd say 5th or 6th was the average finishing spot. Chelsea were **** last year but they won the league the previous season and added Alonso, Luiz, Kante + more so not like they were a team of mugs.

Our players are not good enough and that is the simple truth and now they have run out of steam + injuries to key players. We have run more, sprinted more and rotated the least of any team in the EPL this season so no wonder our remaining fit players look flogged.

We need a bigger squad and Jurgen needs to learn how to rotate and deal with defensive sides. Has he made mistakes - 100% yes. Would I swap him for any other manager - 100% no!

I just hope he learns like Rafa who built a durable team who could mix it and had a plan B in Crouch.

Yes........what he said!!!!

[Big-Red-Ed]

We are where we are at due to a catalogue of poor decisions. I am not deluded. I am saying lets stop making poor decisions.
As for your 2 choices. I agree and would prefer option 2 but it can't be done without serious investment.
I'm just weary of false dawns.

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[calvoboy]

Yet we were quickly out of the cups

We made the semi-final of the League Cup unless I'm mistaken?

Look. We've gone from this:



Spent less than nothing, and now we're at least ten points better off and have competed for the top four throughout the season. That's real progress however you look at it.

Yes we've still got weaknesses, yes we need to invest big to correct them, and yes it's frustrating that we weren't able to sustain what looked like a title challenge pre-January. But we're heading in the right direction at the moment. Us oldies are rightly annoyed at the **** decisions at the club taking us away from the top, but we also know that apart from freaks like Leicester last season, you don't get to be top of the pile overnight from where we've been the last couple of seasons.

[RedReet]

I am an oldie, relatively speaking anyway. I remember us being the best team in the world.

You are deluded if you think that believing we should still be the best team in the world means that we will be

We were on top, and we let the game grow quicker than we did. We fell behind, not far enough to breed Leeds esque defeatism, but close

We are not and have never been capable of competing with those teams financially more powerful than we are. Perhaps the CL win and subsequent years and players convinced us that we should still be top of the tree, but we've probably overachieved given those around us

Money talks in this league and generally we finish where we should, as depressing as that is.

It is quite fully though that the ones most upset about our performance this year are generally the miserable ****ers who expected us to do much worse before the season started.

[Lecter]

I am an oldie, relatively speaking anyway. I remember us being the best team in the world.

You are deluded if you think that believing we should still be the best team in the world means that we will be

We were on top, and we let the game grow quicker than we did. We fell behind, not far enough to breed Leeds esque defeatism, but close

We are not and have never been capable of competing with those teams financially more powerful than we are. Perhaps the CL win and subsequent years and players convinced us that we should still be top of the tree, but we've probably overachieved given those around us

Our choices:

Outspend everyone, win the league with money
Build a squad, give Klopp time to craft his team

Id prefer the latter

Looking back historically its very easy to say the club became complacent

The big thing many of us miss is the effects of Heysel & Hillsborough on the club in terms of its mentality and also financially

So I think the club did take its eye off the ball but it did it to fight other issues & battles

[The_weatherman]

Look at what most people predicted for us and I'd say 5th or 6th was the average finishing spot. Chelsea were **** last year but they won the league the previous season and added Alonso, Luiz, Kante + more so not like they were a team of mugs.

Our players are not good enough and that is the simple truth and now they have run out of steam + injuries to key players. We have run more, sprinted more and rotated the least of any team in the EPL this season so no wonder our remaining fit players look flogged.

We need a bigger squad and Jurgen needs to learn how to rotate and deal with defensive sides. Has he made mistakes - 100% yes. Would I swap him for any other manager - 100% no!

I just hope he learns like Rafa who built a durable team who could mix it and had a plan B in Crouch.

Agree, IF we get a top four place that will be a good season for me, I think I have said that since August, would have liked a cup as well or a longer title challenge, but only strategically speaking, a CL place is so important for the future.

[gratziani]

With the reduced matches and no European games I can see why we didn't strengthen in January.

But Moreno for example was good enough to start in the Europa league final last year yet never gets a run out , if his stock had fallen that far then surely we needed another left back and he should be sold. especially when it looks like Milner needs a break for a week.

Playing Lucas at centre back not liked seeing that at all , Klavan is either the back up or isn't.

The problem for me is how under staffed we have left ourselves on the pitch when that is the most important part of a football club.

Give Klopp money to spend this summer urgently cos we need to bring in about 8 or 9 players with Europe next year on the horizon.

[ronanm]

Even if we get 4th I'll still be disappointed. I'm amazed I seem to be in the minority. Chelsea excellent with the same team as last year. Spurs have improved. Leicester abject. Man city a disgrace given Pep and their ongoing spend. Ditto man Utd. Arsenal almost joke status. Then there's us. No European distraction. Yet we were quickly out of the cups and we are making an ordeal out of top 4 and have been unable to beat many of the lower teams. We are so predictable and easy to defend against. We didn't strengthen when the dogs in the streets could see we needed to. Klopp seems fixated on playing certain players despite obvious loss of form. Our substitutions during games are too slow and sometimes baffling.
However our record against top 6 rivals shows real promise. Our first 11 seems really string and with major investment and continuity I am still hopeful but the honeymoon is now over.

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Agree with a lot of this. But 4th is fine given all the injuries. Anything less is very disappointing. Hoping for a marked improvement next season.

[Paul12]

Playing Lucas at centre back not liked seeing that at all , Klavan is either the back up or isn't.

But playing Lucas there makes the team more progressive, albeit maybe not as solid, so surely it depends what the game needs.

[Tatterdemalion]

Looking back historically its very easy to say the club became complacent

The big thing many of us miss is the effects of Heysel & Hillsborough on the club in terms of its mentality and also financially

So I think the club did take its eye off the ball but it did it to fight other issues & battles

Not that I want to do it to death, but we also had an owner who was more of a fan than a businessman for a long period when the other clubs were building their financial clout.

I'd also take issue with Fierce's comment that we were the best club in the world. We might think so, but I recall the European nights of the 1980s being described as underdogs a few times, especially when playing Madrid and obviously Roma on their own turf. I remember being astonished when we lost to Independiente!

[Lecter]

Not that I want to do it to death, but we also had an owner who was more of a fan than a businessman for a long period when the other clubs were building their financial clout.

The fall or at least the closing of the gap definitely happened before Moores imo

He just didnt have the skills to turn it around

[vlahka]

Moores was ****. Parry was ****.

[frank the tank]

big time....

[BillobShaisley]

Not that I want to do it to death, but we also had an owner who was more of a fan than a businessman for a long period when the other clubs were building their financial clout.

I'd also take issue with Fierce's comment that we were the best club in the world. We might think so, but I recall the European nights of the 1980s being described as underdogs a few times, especially when playing Madrid and obviously Roma on their own turf. I remember being astonished when we lost to Independiente!

And Zico's Flamengo

[fidget]

Not that I want to do it to death, but we also had an owner who was more of a fan than a businessman for a long period when the other clubs were building their financial clout.

Everton fan