Joe Allen [Sold]

[kris90210]

I honestly think that once players go beyond 13/14 its very hard to improve them technically. Once they go beyond 27/28 its very hard to improve them tactically.

I think rodgers has his work cut out with the skipper if he thinks that he can improve him. Its a case of gerrard doing what he normally does and rodgers putting up with it until he can be phased out. Rafa improved gerrard beyond belief but rodgers wont. Its too late for that.

Instead he needs to focus on the younger players those sub 24/25 and work hard with them.

Really? What makes you think that?

[Rich]

Really? What makes you think that?

Clearly, voodoo. Keep up Kris.

[el matador]

Really? What makes you think that?

because i coach young kids and the golden learning age for young footballers is between 9 and 12.

Thats when they soak in all detail and learn skills that are specific to football ie dribbling, turns, shooting as opposed to non-specific like running, sprinting, balance, jumping,

Before 9ish they focus on core training like agility, balance and co-ordination the so called ABC's of youth athletic training that is not aimed at any one sport in general.

Once you get into over 16's they still do technical work because touching the ball as many times as possible isnt a negative and keeps the player comfortable with the ball but the technical skills ie your technique on the ball is already developed, but they focus a lot more on tactical stuff like shape, organisation and patterns of play.

So basically if your kids cant do the basics by 13/14 they probably never will.

of course it doesnt apply to everyone because i saw marcel dessaily go to ac milan from marseille and become a much much better player technically but 99% of the time it doesnt work like this.

[kris90210]

because i coach young kids and the golden learning age for young footballers is between 9 and 12.

Thats when they soak in all detail and learn skills that are specific to football ie dribbling, turns, shooting as opposed to non-specific like running, sprinting, balance, jumping,

Before 9ish they focus on core training like agility, balance and co-ordination the so called ABC's of youth athletic training that is not aimed at any one sport in general.

Once you get into over 16's they still do technical work because touching the ball as many times as possible isnt a negative and keeps the player comfortable with the ball but the technical skills ie your technique on the ball is already developed, but they focus a lot more on tactical stuff like shape, organisation and patterns of play.

So basically if your kids cant do the basics by 13/14 they probably never will.

of course it doesnt apply to everyone because i saw marcel dessaily go to ac milan from marseille and become a much much better player technically but 99% of the time it doesnt work like this.

That's very interesting! I cant actually think of too many players who have massively developed their technique once they've hit a certain age, but I do find it kindof hard to believe that it can't be improved significantly beyond 13/14! That just seems way too young - especially considering the relatively small amount of training they will have received up to that point compared with what they will receive afterwards, and that's not to mention the quality of coaching gets better the closer you are to the first team!

Strange one!

[little dave hedgehog]

mine improved dramatically when i was about 17.

[el matador]

That's very interesting! I cant actually think of too many players who have massively developed their technique once they've hit a certain age, but I do find it kindof hard to believe that it can't be improved significantly beyond 13/14! That just seems way too young - especially considering the relatively small amount of training they will have received up to that point compared with what they will receive afterwards, and that's not to mention the quality of coaching gets better the closer you are to the first team!

Strange one!

thats more or less the experience of every single coach ive ever talked to including coaches from professional academies and my own.

you might find this unbelievable but if a player hasnt been taken on by a pro club by 11, its considered to be too late for that player to make it in the game.

Again, its a generalisation and wont apply in every case but the scouting is focused at younger levels sub 11 and then more sporadically after that age. I will give you an example - Leeds united run an annual tournament at their academy base for reception kids and the age of the players is 5 / 6.

Thats the only youth tournament open to amateur clubs they run as far as im aware.

[kris90210]

thats more or less the experience of every single coach ive ever talked to including coaches from professional academies and my own.

you might find this unbelievable but if a player hasnt been taken on by a pro club by 11, its considered to be too late for that player to make it in the game.

Again, its a generalisation and wont apply in every case but the scouting is focused at younger levels sub 11 and then more sporadically after that age. I will give you an example - Leeds united run an annual tournament at their academy base for reception kids and the age of the players is 5 / 6.

Thats the only youth tournament open to amateur clubs they run as far as im aware.

Well it is interesting. Still have a hard time getting my head round that, mind. I'm pretty interested in doing some coaching with kids myself. What tips would you have for someone who wanted to get into that?

[yamiedo]

I think technique can be improved at any age. Especially in my case. I hadn't been playing football for about 6 years. Started again last year and have been playing regularly. My technique was horrible when I started up again. Since then i feel it has been improving very steadily.

[Neil Young]

mine improved dramatically when i was about 17.

And how is your professional football career going?

[Neil Young]

I think technique can be improved at any age. Especially in my case. I hadn't been playing football for about 6 years. Started again last year and have been playing regularly. My technique was horrible when I started up again. Since then i feel it has been improving very steadily.

I'm sure that's right. There are guys I used to play five a side with who are still playing and getting better, just because they play every week (although I think it might be also because everyone has slowed down ). But all the same their prospects of getting a lucrative contract at a top, top club look fairly slim.

[el matador]

if youve played a bit of footie and are genuinely interested in developing players then go along to one of your local amateur clubs and say you want to get involved.

What they will do is to allocate you a specific group of kids from say reception and you work with them until open age if you want.

The key thing when working with kids is that if you want to prove the tactical prowess you think you have because of five seasons playing champ manager on the pc then this isnt the right environment for you. Simply because you want to win and youth football and winning shouldnt come in the same sentence.

However, if you genuinely want to work with kids and you have their best interests at heart and not your own then you can take enormous satisfaction from seeing them grow into little footballers right infront of your eyes.

Its ridiculously rewarding but be prepared to commit at least one if not two evenings a week to training. Sunday mornings for matches and probably another four - five hours per week planning sessions, tweaking tactics, preparing for games etc...

You seem like a nice guy and as long as you're not in this for yourself you will do just fine.

[el matador]

I think technique can be improved at any age. Especially in my case. I hadn't been playing football for about 6 years. Started again last year and have been playing regularly. My technique was horrible when I started up again. Since then i feel it has been improving very steadily.

as with anything in life you get better with practice. but the cognitive functions governing this sort of learning - ie skills specific to certain sports is at its best during 9-12.

After that learning becomes much harder so developing technique is also much harder if not imposible. Practice makes perfect but that age is the most important learning time for any child doing sports / crafts.

[el matador]

I'm sure that's right. There are guys I used to play five a side with who are still playing and getting better, just because they play every week (although I think it might be also because everyone has slowed down ). But all the same their prospects of getting a lucrative contract at a top, top club look fairly slim.

experience.

as you get older, you start thinking about the game more than you did when you were younger because your legs could carry you about the pitch. So you learn to pace yourself and become better positionally, tactically etc...

also you gain experience of certain situations and know what to do because you've done that particular experience thousands of times and so you know how to react in specific scenarios.

But how do you teach experience to young kids. You cant, so at 13 theyve either got it or they havent because top level football isnt played by 50 year old men.

no disrespect to anyone

[Neil Young]

Nah, these guys are all still at varying levels of ****ness. It's not because they're experienced, it's because they started off our five a sides with virtually no technical skills at all because they weren't taught them when young and most people never saw any more than a few minutes of highlights on MOTD every week and English football then was just kick and run played on mudbanks and played with all the technical virtuosity of a wet sponge falling forty thousand feet and hitting concrete.

But actually I was agreeing with your point.

[el matador]

Nah, these guys are all still at varying levels of ****ness. It's not because they're experienced, it's because they started off our five a sides with virtually no technical skills at all because they weren't taught them when young and most people never saw any more than a few minutes of highlights on MOTD every week and English football then was just kick and run played on mudbanks and played with all the technical virtuosity of a wet sponge falling forty thousand feet and hitting concrete.

But actually I was agreeing with your point.

so many years later thats still what going on. The pitches are **** and unplayable in the winter months. thats why we dont produce decent players.

until the govt pay for more astro turf / artificial pitches or put more funds into amateur clubs so they can build their own this will continue to happen. You cant teach kids to pass on mud.