Hammill - the return of the prodigal son?

[Guest]

no offence fredo but honestly u see more to a game at the ground, player movement, tactics and positional sense.

1000s booed last week, why don't u go tell em their a disgrace? they paid their money and showed their frustration at the end of the game. u might not like it but thats their prerogative.

neil, i really thought the booing was poor form, but then so was rafa's idiotic substitutions. fans are fickle, next week we'll be chanting the rafa song.

Mate no offense but you're really an arse of the highest order. Rafa knows his players and tactics better than you. I won't ever have any confidence in what you say even if you were my boss.

At a football ground you have one angle where you can watch the match but on TV you get the added benefit of TV replays and different viewing angles. For example it would be impossible to spot some offside traps moves if you're badly positioned. You could still see it yes but you don't have the benefit to watch a replay if you've missed it. And sometimes we have Rafa's socks zoomed for our viewing pleasure.

[rage]

Mate no offense but you're really an arse of the highest order. Rafa knows his players and tactics better than you. I won't ever have any confidence in what you say even if you were my boss.

so explain the substitution

At a football ground you have one angle where you can watch the match but on TV you get the added benefit of TV replays and different viewing angles. For example it would be impossible to spot some offside traps moves if you're badly positioned. You could still see it yes but you don't have the benefit to watch a replay if you've missed it. And sometimes we have Rafa's socks zoomed for our viewing pleasure.

i think you actually need to go to a game to appreciate the off ball (out of camera) movement

[Neil Young]

neil, i really thought the booing was poor form, but then so was rafa's idiotic substitutions. fans are fickle, next week we'll be chanting the rafa song.

Well I wouldn't go so far as to call them idiotic and I'm sure we agree that, even if we both thought they were, it wouldn't justify the booing but I take your point.

[dww]

They can do it if they want but isn't that thinking like a customer rather than thinking like a fan?

That's a good way of putting it actually. I think that people have the right to boo if they want but when it is our support it really disappoints me - especially when it is out of frustration rather than something genuinely unacceptable happening.

[EST_1892]

i think he's bored being loaned out here there and everywhere. bring him home, the boy will shine

I have a soft spot for Blackpool. I was hoping he'd sign a permanent deal. He started off very well but got rotated, then went off the boil but then came good scoring his first goal.

Maybe a championship side is his level for now. Nobobody is ever going to step up untill they get a substantial run of games in the first team of a Premiership club and at Liverpool, it is not a luxury at the moment to be able to do that.

[dww]

I have a soft spot for Blackpool. I was hoping he'd sign a permanent deal. He started off very well but got rotated, then went off the boil but then came good scoring his first goal.

Maybe a championship side is his level for now. Nobobody is ever going to step up untill they get a substantial run of games in the first team of a Premiership club and at Liverpool, it is not a luxury at the moment to be able to do that.

I'm not sure I think that players can show their quality in cameo appearances and fight for a place from there. We saw El Zhar play today and he looks like a decent option but we could still do with another genuine winger.

[EST_1892]

I'm not sure I think that players can show their quality in cameo appearances and fight for a place from there. We saw El Zhar play today and he looks like a decent option but we could still do with another genuine winger.

Aye, this was my point that we have Hammil fighting for a regular role at Blackpool. He's not getting a full 90 mins and is not guaranteed a starting place. If the lad had the special ability about him then surely after 3, 4 or however many seasons he's been loaned out now he would have had some club wanting to sign him full time.

It's a shame. The guy has a talent that could be polished into the finished article. It seems managers don't have that luxury these days. Has has probably been said many a time, there is always this expectation of the next big thing to break through. Your next 18 yr old Owen, or <be sick> Rooney. Few and far between these days.

I went to watch Arsenals youngsters at Turf Moor the other night and they literally are just kids. I can't see how any more than 1 or 2 will play a part in Arsenals future. Wiltshier went off at about 60 mins to jeers of "It's your bedtime", LOL.

[dww]

Aye, this was my point that we have Hammil fighting for a regular role at Blackpool. He's not getting a full 90 mins and is not guaranteed a starting place. If the lad had the special ability about him then surely after 3, 4 or however many seasons he's been loaned out now he would have had some club wanting to sign him full time.

It's a shame. The guy has a talent that could be polished into the finished article. It seems managers don't have that luxury these days. Has has probably been said many a time, there is always this expectation of the next big thing to break through. Your next 18 yr old Owen, or <be sick> Rooney. Few and far between these days.

I went to watch Arsenals youngsters at Turf Moor the other night and they literally are just kids. I can't see how any more than 1 or 2 will play a part in Arsenals future. Wiltshier went off at about 60 mins to jeers of "It's your bedtime", LOL.

I think the loan will have done him good. We shall see how much if he comes back and fight for a first team spot. I often think it can be hard for young flair players to get trusted in the Championship. I think that contrary to Sarb's accusation Rafa is genuinely playing the long game with our reserves.

[EST_1892]

I think the loan will have done him good.

Going to Blackpool has certainly not been detrimental to his career. He has helped Blackpool no end. I think playing in the Championship is better for him than being in the Scottish league.

It just seems anyone who "needs time" these days are not going to get their chance at the highest level.

[dww]

Going to Blackpool has certainly not been detrimental to his career. He has helped Blackpool no end. I think playing in the Championship is better for him than being in the Scottish league.

It just seems anyone who "needs time" these days are not going to get their chance at the highest level.

I think we are beginning to see what I have said for a while though - that Rafa believes players often develop between 21 and 23 where many people on here write people off if they haven't reached 21 fully developed.

[EST_1892]

I think we are beginning to see what I have said for a while though - that Rafa believes players often develop between 21 and 23 where many people on here write people off if they haven't reached 21 fully developed.

This seems to be the case. Players that burst onto the scene at 18 end up "burning out" by their mid/late 20's yet other players come good later in their careers.

It's a hard job (guessing game) being a manager and to know when the right time is for a player to peak. I don't know why you don't rate Babel though. He seems to have all the right ingredients to bake a good cake, what do you see?

[dww]

This seems to be the case. Players that burst onto the scene at 18 end up "burning out" by their mid/late 20's yet other players come good later in their careers.

It's a hard job (guessing game) being a manager and to know when the right time is for a player to peak. I don't know why you don't rate Babel though. He seems to have all the right ingredients to bake a good cake, what do you see?

I see a player who has all the talent to be a huge success but who hides in games and doesn't seem to work or learn. I wouldn't completely write him off but last season I was worried in the first half of the season that he didn't seem to be improving his positioning or movement. In the second half of the season he seemed to improve performance wise but as with our form in general I think it was helped by the number of teams who seemed to all but down tools once safe from relegation which seemed to be half the division last year.

I went into the season hoping to see him at least really trying but he has seemed lacklustre and to not be developing. As a flair player I don't necessarily want him working like Kuyt but if you don't do that you have to always seek positions that are available and put yourself in positions to take risks to break teams down which I don't think he does.

His decision making also seems poor and I think players who have talent but that problem (like Pennant) are less likely to come good. I know that before we bought him the Arsenal scouts rejected the idea of going for him - my suspicion is that they thought that the rough edges he has can't be polished away.

Player development is often non-linear though and he might suddenly kick on but at the minute I'm not that enthusiastic about him. I also admit that I take a more hardline tone just because many others seem to think he is the answer to all our problems so often.

[EST_1892]

I agree. He is by far the answer to all our problems. I must have missed those threads. But the left hand side is not his position. Babels best qualities are up front.

Every team needs a player that can be obscure for 89 mins yet pop up in the 90th for a 1-0 winner. Babel is that type of player IMHO. Problem is he doesn't get that luxury these days. I have no idea if there is some agenda between Rafa and Babel but he needs to get his chance.

The last thing I want is for him to be kept on the fringe frustrating us all. Either get him in the setup or ship out. I really do think he can become the next best thing tho, if given the chance.

[dww]

I agree. He is by far the answer to all our problems. I must have missed those threads. But the left hand side is not his position. Babels best qualities are up front.

Every team needs a player that can be obscure for 89 mins yet pop up in the 90th for a 1-0 winner. Babel is that type of player IMHO. Problem is he doesn't get that luxury these days. I have no idea if there is some agenda between Rafa and Babel but he needs to get his chance.

The last thing I want is for him to be kept on the fringe frustrating us all. Either get him in the setup or ship out. I really do think he can become the next best thing tho, if given the chance.

I really think that he doesn't have an ideal position in our setup. He has a lot to learn either up front or on the left. I actually think he would be better from deep - coming off a flank but it is all guess work at this stage.

I think he should have been given more sub appearances for us but at the minute he hasn't done enough even in terms of flashes of brilliance when given starts.

[Woobus]

Aye, this was my point that we have Hammil fighting for a regular role at Blackpool. He's not getting a full 90 mins and is not guaranteed a starting place. If the lad had the special ability about him then surely after 3, 4 or however many seasons he's been loaned out now he would have had some club wanting to sign him full time.

There is never to much paper talk about a player that age. I would say if he was put on the market a lot of the lower premiershipes would be after him, but as it is Rafa see's him as part of the first team.