If we were in the CL this season

[Zapater]

Quarters with this squad would be optimistic. Alas Schalke made the semi's last year with great luck and indivudual brilliance of Raul, Jurado, Farfan and Neuer

[Shaggy]

No-one noticed my Frank & Nancy Sinatra reference

[CJ]

You can only look at their records in Europe. Kenny even lost to Trelleborg in Europe when he was the manager at Blackburn and that is a one of a very few times his club played in a European competition. We was banned from doing it in the 80'.

So right now and if you look at their records in Europe then Kenny don't stand a chance. Time could change that of course but right now he don't stand a chance.

Could you see Rafa set up his team playing two against three in the middle for example and then don't do anything to correct it? That is a mistake Kenny done a few times. Could you see us not bossing the games at home? We bossed every game at home for years. We didn't collapsed like we did against Sunderland for example. We never collapsed in a game like we did against Tottenham. When we lost a game then it was almost always only by one goal.

Even when we finished outside of the European places we battled in every game. We still had a chance to win every game. We didn't play great but Rafa sat up the team to have a chance in every game. We didn't lose two games in a row in the league for months.

Kenny is still learning the league because it is a very different league compared to 10 years ago. You must play in a very different way now to be successful. Football have changed a lot the last 10 years. Look at the PL 10 years ago and compare it to how it is played now.

Clarke is a big help now the first couple of years.

arn i sort of agree with what your saying but not to that certain degree. Kenny isnt a mug and will make mistakes as rafa has done and will do.

i think a wait and see approach is best rather than the he stands no chance.

remember rafas last year and how we struggled in europe. we did worse the yars after with ownership changes a weaker team and the bodge effect.

also every manager learns constantly well the good ones do. Bodge stopped in 1823.

[Chris]

Could you see Rafa set up his team playing two against three in the middle for example and then don't do anything to correct it?

Well, he didnt do anything to correct us being bullied by Chelsea at home in 2009.

Could you see us not bossing the games at home? We bossed every game at home for years.

Really? Benfica, Marseille, Atletico Madrid (CL), Chelsea 09, Lyon. We were excellent overall in Europe under Rafa but lets not pretend it was all perfect.

We didn't collapsed like we did against Sunderland for example.

What about going 2-0 down at home to Hull? Got a draw, same outcome as Sunderland. Liverpool 1 Aston Villa 3? Reading at home in the FA Cup? Barnsley FA Cup? Reading 3-1 in the league?

We never collapsed in a game like we did against Tottenham.

Everton 3 Liverpool 0 and that was with 11 men! 3-6 v Arsenal, 1-3 v Chelsea in the CL, 1-2 v Arsenal at Anfield, 1-4 v Chelsea in the league, 2-0 in Florence. There was plenty of hapless performances where the performance on the pitch was just baffling.

I'm going to come across as a hater of him when thats not the case at all but why do you pretend everything was perfect? Its ridiculous. And this "it wouldnt have happened under Rafa" stuff everytime we have a bad game is annoying. The time was right for him to go, he was broken by the end of it and making some appalling decisions and signings, unfortunately his replacement was the worst manager this country has probably ever seen but the time was right for him and us.

[Kenneth]

I'm a fan of Rafa, but Arn's posts make me want to hate him sometimes.

[Norbs]

I'm trying my hardest to ignore the whole thing at the moment.

[Craig_H]

Arn, i dont think your Rafa PR machine is working....

[CJ]

it will have the opposite effect.

maybe he really is a rafa hater but is being subblte to get everyone else to dislike him too

[Zapater]

Arn, i dont think your Rafa PR machine is working....

It's doing the opposite actually.

[CJ]

i do dislike it when it gets to a black and white two different sides type discussion.

i imagine there a few who really dislike rafa and soo glad he has gone (dont understand that viewpoint but i imagine there are a few). there will be the arns who are totally the other side.

the majority of people will be somewhere between but once you get the arn type argument from either side you sort of end up arguing only the extreme end of the spectrum when the reality is the view is some good some bad things

[Tee]

i do dislike it when it gets to a black and white two different sides type discussion.

i imagine there a few who really dislike rafa and soo glad he has gone (dont understand that viewpoint but i imagine there are a few). there will be the arns who are totally the other side.

the majority of people will be somewhere between but once you get the arn type argument from either side you sort of end up arguing only the extreme end of the spectrum when the reality is the view is some good some bad things

This.

Personally I hope Rafa comes back as Manager one day.

[Norbs]

I'm a fan of Rafa, but Arn's posts make me want to hate him sometimes.

[Mattshark]

I think only 2 groups we would struggle to move on would be A (Bayern and Cityh) and H (Barca and Milan) and possibly F (Arsenal and Borussia).

If we were in any other group we should be able to get to the next round as the quality of the opposition in those is pretty poor.

I think we would have trouble in any group to get through.

[Craig_H]

Come on Matt!

You think we'd struggle with Basle, Benfica and Oletulululululu Gelati???

[Kenneth]

I think we'd concede a lot. Probably score a lot too though.