Jordan Henderson

[Neil Young]

I think there is a real problem with people extrapolating from their impressions of this sort of thing. Lucas wasn't a very physical tackler and even now doesn't 'fly in' very often. When he was playing badly people interpreted this as a lack of desire. I think it is very hard to extrapolate from what you see to what is going on in someones head.

I think Nicey goes a little too far but his point that people held their opinions about Lucas long after they stopped having any basis in fact remains true. No one is perfect and I think people need to accept sometimes they read the situation incorrectly rather than trying to construct a narrative that means that they have always been right.

...As I have always said.

[Norbs]

...And I before he

[Tee]

...And I before he

Except after me

[Fredo]

...And I before he

Id

[Nicey]

I think there is a real problem with people extrapolating from their impressions of this sort of thing. Lucas wasn't a very physical tackler and even now doesn't 'fly in' very often. When he was playing badly people interpreted this as a lack of desire. I think it is very hard to extrapolate from what you see to what is going on in someones head.

I think Nicey goes a little too far but his point that people held their opinions about Lucas long after they stopped having any basis in fact remains true. No one is perfect and I think people need to accept sometimes they read the situation incorrectly rather than trying to construct a narrative that means that they have always been right.

How do I go too far ?

[Kenneth]

henderson's not had 40 games in centre mid tho has he. of those he has in his preferred position, he's been a pretty good player, even up against top quality.

what you're saying is like buying a striker, playing him on the wing and complaining he's not scoring 20+ a season. well, there are mitigating circumstances arent there...

also, this value for money point is missing the fact that a player can be the right or wrong player irrespective of the fee paid. a transfer fee paid historically doesnt play much of a part in a selling decision. sure we'd like to profit from or minimise losses from transfers but if we screw up and overpay, we're going to take a hit on it and get on with trying to take the club forward. what we've done this last summer is accept that fact, respond accordingly (wage bill) and move on. If we lose 30 mill on CHAD then so be it. the mistakes are already made and the damage already done.

selling henderson because he didnt prove to be 'value for money' during the first season is bonkers. Selling him because the manager sees no future for him and would rather get what we're being offered in exchange is the only reason to sell a player.

if we don't sell him then its up to him to grab any chances that come his way and prove to the manager that he should be kept. the fact rodgers was willing to let him go last summer doesnt mean he would be this transfer window. all depends what rodgers is offered for him doesnt it.

Very true.

[Norbs]

Except after me

[Norbs]

Id :handdhake:

Id what? Hope that cleard up before the weekend mate

[TheElephantMan]

I think there is a real problem with people extrapolating from their impressions of this sort of thing. Lucas wasn't a very physical tackler and even now doesn't 'fly in' very often. When he was playing badly people interpreted this as a lack of desire. I think it is very hard to extrapolate from what you see to what is going on in someones head.

I think Nicey goes a little too far but his point that people held their opinions about Lucas long after they stopped having any basis in fact remains true. No one is perfect and I think people need to accept sometimes they read the situation incorrectly rather than trying to construct a narrative that means that they have always been right.

I was more positive about Lucas during the beginning of his Liverpool career than anybody I know, I could see he had real ability. He was guilty of bottling out of challenges and that's why people got frustrated with him. He's an excellent player now so it doesn't really matter, I recognise that although they are different types of players Henderson seems to be at a similar level now that Lucas was earlier on and I believe he has the ability to become an excellent player too. I've never slagged off either Lucas or Henderson even though I could see why some supporters were giving them stick. Some people on here (not you DWW) just can't accept that there might be an acceptable alternative view to their own.

[Alex]

I thought Lucas was gonna be gash. Glad to be proven wrong. I thought Henderson was going to be brilliant, but I have yet to see.

Point is everyone sees different in players from their own perspective.

[TheElephantMan]

I thought Lucas was gonna be gash. Glad to be proven wrong. I thought Henderson was going to be brilliant, but I have yet to see.

Point is everyone sees different in players from their own perspective.

[Nicey]

I thought Lucas was gonna be gash. Glad to be proven wrong. I thought Henderson was going to be brilliant, but I have yet to see.

Point is everyone sees different in players from their own perspective.

Fair enough but sometimes that perspective is not only bull****, but also bad form and pretty harmful for a young player trying to make his way in the game.

Henderson is not even in the team, how can anybody Judge him, its almost key stroke for key stroke the abuse he is getting compared to Lucas .. theres been several games were hes been excellent, actually not so quietly went about his business but really put himself about verbally at the very least on the pitch, performed well, kept it tight and did a dam fine job and yet he was still **** in many peoples eyes ... I just wish the same people who thought Lucas would be ****e would learn to give players a little more space to prove them wrong ... Another classic is Enrique ... he is obviously a class player .. who recently went through a dip in form .. for what ever reason although obviously he was coming back from injury ... Anyways .. again posters saying he was **** ... hes not winger and hes no Lb .. oh really ? well hes scored 1 and made 2 and kept 3 clean sheets in recent games .. how anybody can call that guy **** is beyond me .....

Whilst people are entitled to there opinions, people are also entitled to say said opinions are utterly barmy

[Mostar]

I think he just needs confidence and guidance as to what his role is for the team.

I don't think it is that simple.

His game needs to improve quite a bit as right or wrong we didn't pay pocket change to acquire him nor his wages are modest to say at least.

That may not his fault but he has shown very little to warrant that type of investment and it is still very doubtful if he will ever make it with us.

Time will tell but any comparison with Lucas from the early days is silly to say at least as they are completely different type of players, they have different type of personality, they play in completely different set of circumstances and squad quality, they carried different set of expectations when we bought them and their wages and purchase price are quite different as well.

[Nicey]

The comparison is in just the unfair judgements they are recieving, at least Lucas had a lot more game time, Hendo who obviously is the different type of player has not had a consistent run in the team. Personally I am extremely happy to have him in the squad and hope he can force his way into the team, I think he has something special about him and with a little bit of luck he could flourish in the next couple of years.

[yamiedo]

I don't think it is that simple.

His game needs to improve quite a bit as right or wrong we didn't pay pocket change to acquire him nor his wages are modest to say at least.

That may not his fault but he has shown very little to warrant that type of investment and it is still very doubtful if he will ever make it with us.

Time will tell but any comparison with Lucas from the early days is silly to say at least as they are completely different type of players, they have different type of personality, they play in completely different set of circumstances and squad quality, they carried different set of expectations when we bought them and their wages and purchase price are quite different as well.

Never compared him to Lucas. Just said he was calling on the spirit of Lucas to help him through difficult times as half a joke. Seem's to be getting his head down, not moaning and getting on with it, the way Lucas did.