Georginio Wijnaldum

[Paul12]

That’s nonsense, with all due respect.

Mmm...I realised, having submitted the message, that as expressed it probably wasn't that helpful a comment, for at least two reasons: (1) I did not mean to suggest that the comments to which I was referring were racist or were some other sort of extreme abuse, so maybe 'appalling' was not the right word; and (2) in any case what appalls me might not appall others. So for that I apologise; I am sorry.

I continue though to be of the view that some of the comments posted on this website when we lose (and even when we go behind in a game) are way over the top (hence the, I believe, widely held view that the website is best avoided at such times) and in my view Gini has been the focus of more such comments than most other players in the last couple of years. So I think what he has said is fair comment...unfortunately. He does not appear to be suggesting though that that is what drove him out of the club though.

[Doc_Piptorious]

I think he played exactly how Klopp asks him to. Keita get the same criticism playing the same role. That not to say Wijnanldum didnt have the odd poor game. I think out midfielders do get judged a bit harshly if they are not seeing doing something flashy

Would be surprised if anyone expected a lot of flashy play from any of our midfielders tbh. Closest we have to that sort of midfielder is Thiago with his passing.

I also think that Wijnaldum had more than the odd sub par game the season just gone, but having said that he also put in plenty of high quality performances during his time at the club.

Don't think the criticism Keita gets is/was the same as what Wijnaldum got as they are very different players in terms of what they bring and one tended to play in a deeper role usually whereas the other would play in a more advanced role.

TBF I think the majority of what gets said about Keita revolves around how often he is unavailable rather than his ability or style of play.

[Charly]

I think he played exactly how Klopp asks him to. Keita get the same criticism playing the same role. That not to say Wijnanldum didnt have the odd poor game. I think out midfielders do get judged a bit harshly if they are not seeing doing something flashy

[Mark79]

They probably will. He isn’t saying it’s particular to any club. But obviously it hurts more when it’s a club where you’ve contributed and achieved so much.

[Kenneth]

Like I say, because I don’t think it’s particular to any club. Newcastle fans accused him of only turning up at home. PSG fans will find something to judge him and criticise him on too.

[Mark79]

He thought it was unfair and made him feel undervalued by a section of the fan base.
Ultimately of course it was a contractual thing, but why wouldn’t something like that come into his mind when deciding whether to move on?

As I say I don’t think it was really a decider in anything and I don’t think he’s making it out to be either. But why shouldn’t he talk about it and put his side across when it clearly soured the end of his time here?

[Kenneth]

If you're repeatedly wrongly criticised about something, then what's the problem with answering back and correcting people about it?

Nowt, but using as part of an explanation of a desire to change clubs doesn’t really stack up.

[Mark79]

If you're repeatedly wrongly criticised about something, then what's the problem with answering back and correcting people about it?

[Kenneth]

There’s not much wrong with brainless criticism either. Let’s say his form last season was all tiredness, all that says is that people questioning his commitment on the Internet were wrong. What’s the problem and how’s it relevant to him leaving? I definitely don’t believe that Liverpool fans are harsher and more commonly wrong than any other group, so I’m not sure of the relevance. The hints at potentially dramatic issues behind the scenes seems to have been nothing, and he’s not our player anymore, there doesn’t seem to be a cause for an inquisition so everyone carries on as before, and he starts a new life being abused in French.

[Exiled_red]

It's a difficult one for me, I can't say I was aware of the abuse that he was getting obviously that doesn't mean he wasn't getting any or that it wasn't affecting him.

In terms of how he was valued, he was on a decent wage when he came in 5 years ago. Obviously the market has changed in that time, we have brought in some better quality players and won some trophies since then. It's over 2 years since the club offered to double his salary, but he didn't sign the contract. If he isn't willing to sign a new contract he is obviously going to remain undervalued until he leaves. I found it frustrating that the club wouldn't offer him a longer deal given he is one of the first names on the team sheet and he has always been available. In terms of the fans maybe some didn appreciate him in the first couple of years but I would say most did the years we won the CL and PL. As the team performance level dropped this year he got a bit more stick and comments questioning his commitment given the contract situation (which were out of order IMO) but seem par for the course nowadays.

[Mark79]

Actual abuse or just criticism when he played badly? He put in a number of sub par (by his own standards) performances this season and a lot of the time those bad performances came when he was one of the senior players in the team that we would be hoping to guide the less senior players.


I see nothing wrong with discussing and criticising a player's performances on a fan forum tbh, same way there is nothing wrong with praising a good performance.

If it slips into personal abuse about a player though that is a different story altogether and totally out line.



On a related note I look forward to Charly sending Philips screenshots of me calling him a bum a la Mickey from Rocky and Philips then going public to say I am the reason he left the club.

Nothing wrong with fair criticism, the problem was so much of it was brainless.

I saw the ‘coasting’ and ‘saving himself for a move’ accusations a lot last season. The guy played well over 5000 minutes in a condensed season, a game every 3 or 4 days non stop. If he was ever off the pace, below par or even trying to conserve himself at times to keep himself available and on the pitch, then no wonder.

But no consideration for that from those who decided it was a blatant lack of desire or commitment from him.

[RedReet]

I wasn't aware of his salary in comparison to others, but if I'm being totally honest, I have zero sympathy anyway when it comes to the pay of top footballers.

He was a great footballer for us though.

Agreed

Although I genuinely don't think it was about the money for Gini.

[fabinho]

He was our lowest earning midfielder. Henderson, Fabinho, Thiago, Ox, Keita, Milner all on more than him. Most new signings get major pay rises after 1st o r2nd season when here, he didn't. Doesn't matter if he's on £500k per week if everyone else is on £800k, it all relative. So yes, statistically undervalued financially by the club.

For years Gini got abused for being invisible and not influencing games. This quietened a bit during our successful seasons, but as he alludes to himself, after every bad team performance he was one of the first in line for abuse. I'm not gonna start digging out quotes, but there are countless examples.

I wasn't aware of his salary in comparison to others, but if I'm being totally honest, I have zero sympathy anyway when it comes to the pay of top footballers.

He was a great footballer for us though.

[RedReet]

Actual abuse or just criticism when he played badly? He put in a number of sub par (by his own standards) performances this season and a lot of the time those bad performances came when he was one of the senior players in the team that we would be hoping to guide the less senior players.


I see nothing wrong with discussing and criticising a player's performances on a fan forum tbh, same way there is nothing wrong with praising a good performance.

If it slips into personal abuse about a player though that is a different story altogether and totally out line.



On a related note I look forward to Charly sending Philips screenshots of me calling him a bum a la Mickey from Rocky and Philips then going public to say I am the reason he left the club.

I'm sure there was personal abuse, but TBH it's just the lazy criticism I'm referring to. People labelled him the invisible man, so loved an excuse to say he was invisible. When players are pigeon holed like that, you then get people weighing in and criticising their performances in matches they didn't even watch, but still couldn't miss an opportunity to criticise. You may say that's fair enough, the criticism is warranted, but I say it's tedious and unfair.

And TBH, Gini isn't the worst example, nowhere near it, but he doesn't have to be. If he feels he was unfairly targeting for criticism and was upset by it, then who cares how severe it was.

[Kenneth]

Some of the stuff that is posted on this website after the team has lost is appalling

That’s nonsense, with all due respect.