Not liking the reports coming out from Athens

[disco]

disco, its so hypothetical, people with tickets arriving late were also involved, people with unsuspecting forgeries also were caught up. one thing i do know, is that you and uefa have found someone to blame and we will never know the true amount of people without tickets that actually got into the ground.

Why would people with tickets (whether genuine or not) deliberately cause a crush?

The crush is caused by people trying to get through without being checked - and you know this - they are trying to disrupt/confuse the process and it ****ing worked didn't it?

As we keep saying - no-one's debating that Uefa ****ed up the ticketing, the debate is whether this gives fans the right to try and get into the match despite the situation.

I'm saying it doesn't. You and Alun (I think) are saying it does - correct me if I'm wrong.

[sean_lfc]

Well, that's ultimately UEFA's role, not mine or yours, but yes that would help if we could come out with a better solution.

As regards to allocation, it would be virtually impossible to evaluate how much we would need simply because we are the most (if not one of the most) popular clubs in the world, so supporters could be coming in from everywhere.

UEFA played it right by signalling from the off that there would be no more than 17,00 tickets available. It's simple really.

Good job all the other fans just said 'Aw well ****it, there's another final round the corner, I'll just hope I get to that one'
or
'Aw well ****it, got a ticket legitimately and still didn't get in, never mind, I'll just save up a few months' worth of money again and try another time'

'It's simple really'...

[Craig_H]

yeah and what do they do, blame ticketless fans for theyre incompetance, bit like the plane going down and blaming the baggage handler

Tickletless fans SHOULDNT TRY TO GET IN, end of.

Your argument is a bit like saying car companies are responsible for car theft, because they price their product too high...

[Neil Young]

If you're going to sit on the fence you may as well get back to lurking

It's a complex world, Alun. One day you may understand this.

[alunevans]

It's a complex world, Alun. One day you may understand this.

Go and pick the splinters out yer arse

[Guest]

Good job all the other fans just said 'Aw well ****it, there's another final round the corner, I'll just hope I get to that one'
or
'Aw well ****it, got a ticket legitimately and still didn't get in, never mind, I'll just save up a few months' worth of money again and try another time'

'It's simple really'...

Yes it's that simple, do you want me to draw that for you ?

[Revo]

Why would people with tickets (whether genuine or not) deliberately cause a crush?

The crush is caused by people trying to get through without being checked - and you know this - they are trying to disrupt/confuse the process and it ****ing worked didn't it?

As we keep saying - no-one's debating that Uefa ****ed up the ticketing, the debate is whether this gives fans the right to try and get into the match despite the situation.

I'm saying it doesn't. You and Alun (I think) are saying it does - correct me if I'm wrong.

disco i was there, people surged forwards cos there was no turnstile only some mickey mouse barrier checking peoples tickets. why cant you accept that its fans impatience of trying to get in, instead of building some front page nonsense of thousands of fans without tickets are to blame

[disco]

Tickletless fans SHOULDNT TRY TO GET IN, end of.

Your argument is a bit like saying car companies are responsible for car theft, because they price their product too high...

Yes, that's exactly the argument.

I really want that car, I didn't get one or can't afford one - **** it I'll steal it instead.

[Craig_H]

Good job all the other fans just said 'Aw well ****it, there's another final round the corner, I'll just hope I get to that one'
or
'Aw well ****it, got a ticket legitimately and still didn't get in, never mind, I'll just save up a few months' worth of money again and try another time'

'It's simple really'...

But sean, even if they've spent loads, what's the money compared to the safety of people?

[Neil Young]

Go and pick the splinters out yer arse

It is painful but at least it's easy to see both sides of the argument from up here.

[Craig_H]

Anyway, i've been up since 4am yesterday so i'm fecked.

Gonna get some kip. Have fun lads

[sean_lfc]

Yes it's that simple, do you want me to draw that for you ?

Yes please, you seem to use crayons a lot anyway, I'll frame it and keep it for the grandchildren to see.

[Guest]

disco i was there, people surged forwards cos there was no turnstile only some mickey mouse barrier checking peoples tickets. why cant you accept that its fans impatience of trying to get in, instead of building some front page nonsense of thousands of fans without tickets are to blame

Mickey mouse nonsense or not you were still prepared to pay a lot of money in air fares and in forged tickets or whatever to try to get in. Only a fool or a desperate can do that, sorry.

[Revo]

Anyway, i've been up since 4am yesterday so i'm fecked.

Gonna get some kip. Have fun lads

me too havent slept for 3 days, bob thanks for the reminder

[reddragon]

**** that lad.

how can a few lads bunking in as a threat to fans safety be compared to the way uefa have organised this. THEY are the threat to fans safety. THEY are the scum.

a few lads bunking in are just a few lads desperate to see their team because the only way they can get in is to pay a grand to the tout that ****ing UEFA have given a ticket to in the first place.

if you give a **** about fans safety look far higher up the food chain.

seats or no ****ing seats, i guarantee you another hillsborough WILL happen sooner or later if this is how it carries on.

and it'll be a well supported club who it will happen to again.

i'm well pissed off with this.

agree with this wholeheartedly.

i was going in about 3/4 hr before kick off with my dad, brother and a mate. Up until this point all was well, the walk there was on a nice wide road [bit like wembley way] and everyone was enjoying it. We got to the last checkpoint [i hasten to add we all had legit tickets] and were funnelled into a tiny checkpoint [about 2-3mtr wide]. There was lots of confusion and pushing and shoving as nobody knew what the **** was happening. We all got seperated. On the other side of the checkpoint i met up with my brother and we started to wait for the other two. Suddenly, the police closed the checkpoint to maybe 1 mtr wide by driving a bus across it. I could not beleive my eyes - they were creating the crush in front of us and no manner of pleading and taking with them would stop them.
There must have been 150 coppers there - easily enough to create a wide police line type of cordon which would have spread the crush out more - but oh no all they were interested in was battering people who tried to escape the crush. I could hear screams etc. and at this point i, and a few others who were there, were getting VERY worried for the safety of people in this crush.

Anyhow my dad finally got through. We were in tears at this point 'just like the bad old days' We waited and waited but our mate never turned up so we legged it into the ground. Our turnstile had been closed and there were no stewards or police or anything around to let us know why. People milling around there were saying the turnstile things were electronic and they'd broke, so everyone was up and over the turnstile. Once in i again got very scared. The walkway was absolutely crammed and i was thinking that if more people were coming over the gate then a surge that could be very nasty was inevitable. We decided to stay were we were for 10 mins before i tried to get to our seats to see if our mate had got through another way. Needless to say other people were sitting in our seats so at 1/2 time i made my way back up to where me dad and brother where.

Our mate had just come in the ground at this point, all the gates had been opened. He had come through the checkpoint but not before being attacked by a police baton charge and cs gas spray.

The whole day was a ****ing joke anyway. The last time i go to a Euro away.