Kenny isn't what we need

[the rev leeroy brown]

4-4-2 with Lucas and Adam in the middle doesn't work.

agree with this

If he continue to play the same system with the same players then he will be sacked sooner or later because we won't progress as a club playing that system.

disagree with this. we ARE creating chances. we ARE playing decent football. we just need a bit of luck in front of goal.

The question is why we miss a lot of chances? IMO it is because we play 4-4-2 and not getting enough players into the box. We are also playing with a team that lack a lot of pace and movement. You score a lot of goals thanks to having many players in the box. They can go after rebounds etc.

we create more chances than 99% of the other teams in the prem league. why is this if our system is wrong? we arent scoring goals because our finishing has been poor - that is a fact.

That means benching players like Adam and Downing is a must and replace them with players like Maxi and Spearing that is more mobile and thanks to that get into scoring positions more easily.

these two players hould be given more game time granted

We must up our movement and pace or we will continue to drop a lot of points. We must get more difficult to read.

for the first time in years we are more difiicualt to read. by playing pass and move football for the first time since kenny left we are finally unpredictable. in the past we have been efficient in our defending and playing counter attack - that is predictable.

It is very easy to take players like Downing and Adam out of a game. You know what you will get from them. They won't surprise you. You won't know what you will get from a player like Maxi.

again agreed

The result as I said was that Kenny yet again lost the tactical battle.

or perhaps our players just didnt perform against the smaller team again - a player fault, not a tactical one?

Kenny must start to care about how the other team play and stop them playing the way they want. Then he of course also need to set up a tactic to get the best out of our players.

why care about the other team? if we score more goals we win. city, united, arsenal, spurs - these teams set up to win games - not to stop other teams from winning. if we set up to stop a team playing then we are basically adjusting our priority to get a draw!

So far he has been terrible doing the above two things.

We drop many points because of Kenny and not because of the players. That is a big problem.

He must start to win the tactical battles. How many of you believe that he will win the battle against Mancini or AVB?

i do. we perform against big teams. mancini and AVB are not great tacticians - not in the slightest

It won't come at all if we persist with the dinosaur 1980s 4-4-2 and signing British lads because Dalglish reportedly wanted a bit of banter in the dressing room that wasn't there when he arrived.

where did you hear that? IMO thats bull****. dlaglish buys players because of footballing abilites / tactics etc... not to get some banter!!

Anyway it will be sorted soon enough. Probably not soon enough for us to get a top 4 this season, but the owners won't put up with the current shambles beyond the end of the season I'm sure.

If we don't get into the top 4 - and that's looking like pure fantasy right now - the manager will have to go

of course this is obvious isnt it - i mean 3 points off 4th whilst not playing to our potential is a disaster isnt it

[Mostar]

Would be a joke if we started with the same line up against City but I wouldn't be surprised at all. It would be as you say a big own goal.

City will start with three in the middle and completely boss the game if we start with Lucas and Adam as our only two CM.

We would be ripped apart in the same way as United.

Come on Arn...

Kenny wouldn't play Cityh game with Lucas and Adam in the midfield.

Obvious choice would be to play with 2 defensive mids and pairing Lucas and Spearing is what I expect to see.

They did extremely well last time we face them and the similar type of setting is what I think will happen more less.

[Daniel 7]

Some seem to be saying “Kenny has spent this money” or “Kenny has spent that money” and comparing Kenny’s purchases to Rafa’s. (I really hoped I had heard the last of net spend…)

Don’t mean to point out the obvious, but the model for transferring players in is completely different now. From what we are lead to believe, the players we sign are decided upon via consultation between Kenny and Comolli, so to directly compare what Kenny has spent and what Rafa (who was in sole control of the players he wanted) spent, is a bit pointless.

I think its interesting to compare Comolli’s signings at Tottenham with the Liverpool signings, there does seem to be a similarity there.

Eg

For Carroll read Bent
For Downing read Bentley
For Adam/Henderson read Jenas/Murphy/Boateng/Zokora/Gilberto
For Coates read Kaboul

Bit simplistic, but there is a pattern to the signings. The main point to consider though, is that the Spurs side he had a hige hand in putting together took some time to come together, and was added to according to the needs of the team. Once the “consolidation” signings were bedded in, other signings were made like Bale, Berbatov, Lennon and Modric.

Look at the last 3 – Bale, Berbatov and Modric (I know he went to the Mancs) – they were superstar signings, but two of the three took a while to grow into those roles.

Its still hugely early to write this off, and certainly not all of the blame deserves to fall at Kenny’s door. There’s going to be frustration, but we should be able to do it better than Spurs. This is LFC after all, we’re a bit bigger and better than the second side in North London.

[Mostar]

If we had just 1 clinical striker in our team nobody would be discussing formations and numbers IMO.

I made exactly the same point earlier and I firmly believe that is the main root of all evil.

Buy someone like Tevez (wouldn't that be the day), Lavezzi, Klose or Gomez and our goal and points tally would be significantly higher.

[Lecter]

So after eleven pages I think most us agree with that he must change system. 4-4-2 with Lucas and Adam in the middle doesn't work.

That is the most important point.

Then we can go on from there discussing what sort of system he should use etc.

If he don't change system and continue to play 4-4-2 with Lucas and Adam then there is no chance to finish in the top four.

So again he must change system or at least stop playing Lucas and Adam in a 4-4-2.

If he continue to play the same system with the same players then he will be sacked sooner or later because we won't progress as a club playing that system.

The question is why we miss a lot of chances? IMO it is because we play 4-4-2 and not getting enough players into the box. We are also playing with a team that lack a lot of pace and movement. You score a lot of goals thanks to having many players in the box. They can go after rebounds etc.

The times we hit the post/bar we should have more players in a scoring position that can tap it in. We don't.

That means benching players like Adam and Downing is a must and replace them with players like Maxi and Spearing that is more mobile and thanks to that get into scoring positions more easily.

We must up our movement and pace or we will continue to drop a lot of points. We must get more difficult to read.

It is very easy to take players like Downing and Adam out of a game. You know what you will get from them. They won't surprise you. You won't know what you will get from a player like Maxi.

We moan about that we don't have game changers. Well, we have Maxi but he isn't playing.

How many times this season have Kenny won the duel against the other manager? He was again outclassed against Swansea. He did nothing to stop them playing, nothing at all. Their manager stopped us playing our game.

The result as I said was that Kenny yet again lost the tactical battle.

Kenny must start to care about how the other team play and stop them playing the way they want. Then he of course also need to set up a tactic to get the best out of our players.

So far he has been terrible doing the above two things.

We drop many points because of Kenny and not because of the players. That is a big problem.

He must start to win the tactical battles. How many of you believe that he will win the battle against Mancini or AVB?

Lots of opinion very little fact is all I see here

FACT is we are creating chances (as those stats state)

FACT is we are missing bucket loads of chances (as those stats state)

For a team that is so badly set up, too slow and who are carrying at least 2 players that are too predictable (Adam & Downing) it makes you wonder how we are creating and missing so many chances

You would have a valid point if the team wasnt functioning, wasnt creating chances etc.. but it is so your points look a tad wide of the mark

The ironic thing is that probably our most unpredictable and exciting player is one of the ones who has been failing as much as anyone in front of goal

We drop points because our players miss chances, it has **** all to do with tactics or Kenny's managerial style

Stoke, Norwich, Swansea we have created enough chances to win 10 games nevermind 3

[Lecter]

I made exactly the same point earlier and I firmly believe that is the main root of all evil.

Buy someone like Tevez (wouldn't that be the day), Lavezzi, Klose or Gomez and our goal and points tally would be significantly higher.

Agreed

Root of all our evil is missing chances

Frankly I have been surprised by the level of profligacy in front of goal

The team as a whole needs to step up and start putting away their chances

If they cant do it then we clearly need to buy someone who can

[IN_RAFA_WE_TRUST]

What's that you are saying about 4 3 3 arn?

[Lecter]

What's that you are saying about 4 3 3 arn?

Apparently a change of formation will enable Suarez et al to score the chances they are currently missing all too frequently under a 4-4-2 system

[Baracus]

Agreed

Root of all our evil is missing chances

Frankly I have been surprised by the level of profligacy in front of goal

The team as a whole needs to step up and start putting away their chances

If they cant do it then we clearly need to buy someone who can

Just one is not going to be enough if we do need to buy. We need 2. When Gerrard is not playing who else from Midfield is going to score on a regular basis?

[RichC]

Apparently a change of formation will enable Suarez et al to score the chances they are currently missing all too frequently under a 4-4-2 system

it's all clear now 7-0 wins once we move to a new system

[danperkins]

I made exactly the same point earlier and I firmly believe that is the main root of all evil.

Buy someone like Tevez (wouldn't that be the day), Lavezzi, Klose or Gomez and our goal and points tally would be significantly higher.

[Lecter]

Just one is not going to be enough if we do need to buy. We need 2. When Gerrard is not playing who else from Midfield is going to score on a regular basis?

Thats been a problem for years

Alonso & Mascherano were hardly prolific, Lucas isnt either

In fact I'd go so far as saying if you look at their stats at previous clubs Adam, Downing & Henderson should contribute more than they are doing in terms of goals

Even Carroll & Suarez have better goal returns for their previous clubs

We are definitely underperforming in front of goal and imo it isnt down to lack of ability of the players we have

[Baracus]

Thats been a problem for years

Alonso & Mascherano were hardly prolific, Lucas isnt either

In fact I'd go so far as saying if you look at their stats at previous clubs Adam, Downing & Henderson should contribute more than they are doing in terms of goals

Even Carroll & Suarez have better goal returns for their previous clubs

We are definitely underperforming in front of goal and imo it isnt down to lack of ability of the players we have

Something is clearly wrong with the attack.

But how much longer can we say they need time to gel, adapt?

4 out the 5 are British players with plenty of Premiership experience.

Maybe those 4 are not use to playing 4-4-2??

[danperkins]

Something is clearly wrong with the attack.

But how much longer can we say they need time to gel, adapt?

4 out the 5 are British players with plenty of Premiership experience.

Maybe those 4 are not use to playing 4-4-2??

This is the issue IMO, we need to fix this sooner rather than later. We are still within range and with such tough fixtures coming up it's important not to drift away.

Can we really afford to play underperforming players? For me i'd like to see Downing/Henderson & Adam replaced by Bellamy/Maxi & Gerrard (injury permitting)

With those 3 in, IMO we look a much stronger side.

[Mostar]

Agreed

Root of all our evil is missing chances

Frankly I have been surprised by the level of profligacy in front of goal

The team as a whole needs to step up and start putting away their chances

If they cant do it then we clearly need to buy someone who can

I think we will have to but the potential issue is that whoever we buy, if that happens in January, may need time to settle as there is no guarantee that he'll start clicking on all cylinders immediately like Suarez did.

I also think that we have too many new players and injuries to our key personnel so it is very difficult to find the winning formula cause it takes time to blend all the pieces.

The potential issue of course is not necessarily that we are growing impatient with the lack of good performance but the doubt that we have right types of players but I guess the time will tell.

That said, no excuses here as if we want to go to CL, regardless of who we put on the pitch we should be good enough to win over 2 relegation candidates and mediocre club like Sunderland playing at home.

Personally I think we are at least 2 players short to make it and stay in top 4 and it will be very interesting to see if we will strengthen our squad in January and what type of footballers we'll go after.