Jordan Henderson

[danperkins]

You honestly think when Klopp is picking the team that he's thinking 'I'd love to play Can in the holding midifeld role, we'd be so much stronger, but that ****er Henderson is captain, so I'm going to have to put up with his **** again'?

No but dropping your club captain is a lot harder than dropping others.

[RedReet]

No but dropping your club captain is a lot harder than dropping others.

But you do believe that Klopp would prefer to play someone else in DM, but doesn't feel he can drop Henderson because he is captain?

Considering our VC has been bombed out of the team and Klopp had used 7 different captains in his first few months here, I don't think he puts much stock in the role, certainly not enough to omit a certain player to the detriment of the team.

[cream]

Drop him for who?

[Charly]

Is Can disciplined enough to sit there?

[danperkins]

But you do believe that Klopp would prefer to play someone else in DM, but doesn't feel he can drop Henderson because he is captain?

Considering our VC has been bombed out of the team and Klopp had used 7 different captains in his first few months here, I don't think he puts much stock in the role, certainly not enough to omit a certain player to the detriment of the team.

I would much rather have Can back at DM, only have way decent option for that position but we don't really have anyone specifically suited to that role. Can for me is the best option.

I never said he was undroppable because he was a captain but surely your captain and vice captain being dropped isn't exactly ideal.

[kev776]

This is our problem, none of our midfielders are trained properly in this role, the closest may be Milner because he appears to be the only one who listens.

[danperkins]

This is our problem, none of our midfielders are trained properly in this role, the closest may be Milner because he appears to be the only one who listens.

balance is all over the place, square pegs in round holes.

[dww]

This is our problem, none of our midfielders are trained properly in this role, the closest may be Milner because he appears to be the only one who listens.

I honestly don't think Klopp wants a genuine holding player. He wants a mobile 'net' style pressing defence. I would rather have a defensive pivot there but I think the make up of our midfield is deliberate. IIRC towards the end of his time at Dortmund Klopp faced a lot of criticism because his midfield lacked 'shape'.

My feeling is that the way we play puts too high a stress on individuals in both boxes and that particularly in defence we lack the quality. Getting or developing the right players is hard though.

[danperkins]

Didn't Klopp play with Sven Bender & Seb Kehl? This is why I am so surprised he has setup like this since coming to LFC. Even Gundogan was a competitive holding midfielder.

[dww]

Didn't Klopp play with Sven Bender & Seb Kehl? This is why I am so surprised he has setup like this since coming to LFC. Even Gundogan was a competitive holding midfielder.

Bender is certainly a very Klopp version of a DM - like Henderson or Can he mostly runs to close rather than using positional discipline. I don't think that there is a big difference in setup to be honest. There might be a difference in the skillset or experience ding the particular role though.

[dom9]

Bender is certainly a very Klopp version of a DM - like Henderson or Can he mostly runs to close rather than using positional discipline.

Bit late in the tackle by all accounts though.

[danperkins]

Bender is certainly a very Klopp version of a DM - like Henderson or Can he mostly runs to close rather than using positional discipline. I don't think that there is a big difference in setup to be honest. There might be a difference in the skillset or experience ding the particular role though.

Maybe Klopp is guilty of playing a system that were suited to his Dortmund side but not to the personnel of the LFC side.

With our defence being the way it is, someone like Kante would do wonders for us. As you said Klopp for some reason or another does not seem to want that type of player. We have made some serious blunders in this window and remains to be seen how we will stand by the time the next window comes around. I really hope we are still in contention for the top spots by then.

[dww]

I think Keita is 'that type of player'. I also think that tactically Can and Henderson are quite similar to that role. Just that neither is as good as Kante (who to be fair is a genuine superstar). I also think teams are more used to playing against pressing teams now than when Klopp was most successful at Dortmund.

In general though I don't think our midfield is bad defensively at all. It's more that once through there is a very high chance of a goal as both fullbacks bomb on and our CBs are neither exceptional in open play or from set pieces. I honestly think people pick parts of our team that are working well apart because of failings in both boxes.

[danperkins]

I think Keita is 'that type of player'. I also think that tactically Can and Henderson are quite similar to that role. Just that neither is as good as Kante (who to be fair is a genuine superstar). I also think teams are more used to playing against pressing teams now than when Klopp was most successful at Dortmund.

In general though I don't think our midfield is bad defensively at all. It's more that once through there is a very high chance of a goal as both fullbacks bomb on and our CBs are neither exceptional in open play or from set pieces. I honestly think people pick parts of our team that are working well apart because of failings in both boxes.

For me the problem lies with the balance. As has been said before many times on here, Can, Hendo & Wini are all just too similar. Keita will make a big difference in there as he is more combative than the rest and has that pace through the middle but he is also box to box. Can't be a coincidence that Klopp wants an all energy type midfield but will that balance be right even with Keita in there? Personally I don't think so as Coutinho will be gone next summer aswell.

The pressing game that we first seen under Klopp has been figured out, teams are just popping balls over the top and out wide into the areas we struggle with defensively. All of us will pick holes in a team that isn't winning I suppose, natural being a football supporter. We are a fickle bunch aswell.

[Maxiedge]

I have been critical in the past but, my word, he was different class today.