Jamie Carragher

[Chris]

The first part of your post sums up why I don't consider Carragher to be a legend. Prior to moving to centre back he was just really a limited full back. Then playing alongside Hyppia/Agger and behind Hamman/Masch in a defensively orientated system made him more useful, but for how many seasons has he really been good at centreback? And how much of that good form stems more from other players making him look better than he is?

This is just disrespectful nonsense, he's had his place over the years on merit.

Surely Hyypia wasnt that good afterall then and he was just helped by negative systems, Henchoz, Babbel and co? You cant have it both ways.

Yes he's not that good anymore, yes he's coming to the end but please, stop with this utter crap.

[Muddled]

To take the discussion in a different (but related) direction; would it be fair to say it's difficult to "phase out" a centre back?

[Arn]

To take the discussion in a different (but related) direction; would it be fair to say it's difficult to "phase out" a centre back?

No. Not if it is only one we are talking about. It also of course depends on the system. Man U don't have a problem playing even right backs or left backs as central defenders when they need it.

If the club play the same system in all their teams from youth teams to the first team then it is also a lot easier because the players already know the system inside out.

I also of course depends how long the player played for the club. If he is great leader or not.

[BootRoom]

This is just disrespectful nonsense, he's had his place over the years on merit.

Surely Hyypia wasnt that good afterall then and he was just helped by negative systems, Henchoz, Babbel and co? You cant have it both ways.

Yes he's not that good anymore, yes he's coming to the end but please, stop with this utter crap.

Two points:

1. Yes, Hyypia's weaknesses, notably lack of pace, were mitigated to a large extent by playing in a defensive system and team-mates, but he has other attributes that would shine in any system, such as stature, physical strength, and aerial prowess.

2. Being in the team on merit says more about the lack of quality in the squad team, rather than indication of how fantastic he's been. How many times have we been serious title contenders?

[Muddled]

Perhaps I should have worded it differently. To me, phasing out means gradual; I think our team needs a settled centre back pairing (injuries permitting), so we either drop Carragher now and use this season to experiment with a combination of Skrtel and Agger, or we iron out any mistakes (were possible) during training and use this season to develop Coates (off the pitch, the majority of the time) and stick with Carragher - I don't think there is any middle ground.

[Frenchie]

all this talk of developing Kowatez is balls, he is ready now and would be a better option than Carra right now, everyone knows it but because of Carra's longevity and great service to the club he has to be phased out...utter horsemanure...

Play the best 11 end of, if Kenny and Clarke deem Kowatez ready so be it...

[Chris]

everyone knows it

No, people like you are guessing it and nothing wrong with that but you've not even seen the guy play a club game, it's hardly a definite fact but hopefully he does perform when he plays and he'll surely get his first chance in about 10 days.

[Frenchie]

No, people like you are guessing it and nothing wrong with that but you've not even seen the guy play a club game, it's hardly a definite fact but hopefully he does perform when he plays and he'll surely get his first chance in about 10 days.

I live in Mexico and Latin footie is on everyday, been watching him and loads of others for a while now, you will all be astonished by Kowatez' ability

[Chris]

He's a good player, ive got no doubt, just think its a little early for the he's defo better than Carra stuff. He cant even speak English yet either.

[Daniel 7]

Neither could Skrtel when he moved over straight into the first team. He had a very broad scouser screaming at him and Havant and Waterlooville aside, he did ok.

[Muddled]

But it could be argued that that scouse accent wouldn't be there if it was a Coates for Carragher replacement.

[Frenchie]

What has that got to do with it, I have 2 young Irish lads living with me training for my father-in-law's team Leones Negros doing all they can to secure their first pro contract, they couldnt speak Spanish but on the pitch they understand everything...

Coates is a bit of a phenomenon, you will see this once he plays... He could play in any league in the world and excel.. He is just that good..
imho of course

[Muddled]

It's a small point (about the language), but a valid one none-the-less. And it's a point amongst others, like he's new to the team, new to the style of play, new to the pace, new to our system and that's before we even talk about upping sticks and settling in a new country.

Attackers have the luxury of knowing if they miss a goal, they might get another chance, as a defender, a mistake could cost you a goal, central defence - IMO - is one of those positions you can't drop a player in to - especially with the other factors mentioned above.

He needs time to bed-in - even more so in a season were we *have* to get fourth.

[Shaggy]

Well Coates will surely play at Brighton which will give us some idea of how ready he may or may not be.

Personally can't wait to see him play and the prospect of a Coates/Agger partnership is really quite exciting.

[Muddled]

I'm looking forward to seeing him play too - I didn't see much of the Copa America and haven't seen him play, so will be interested to see how he does.