Lucas

[JohnDoe]

You can want him to reach the same levels, but simply expecting him to instantly is idiotic.

Well, *I* don't expect him to reach those levels, that's why I want him sold. That's basically the point. He's merely a squad player who can come in and fill a hole. That's okay with me, but being player week in and week out? No way is he good enough, and he probably won't settle for the role I'm suggesting, which is why he should go somewhere else.

[JohnDoe]

Putting in a laughing smiley doesn't pose an argument. Cattermole is a better player than Lucas, simply laughing it off doesn't make it untrue.

[dww]

My feeling remains that Lucas is a sort of player that glues a team together and his role is to get the most out of people. I think last season the problem was that the players whose impact he should be enhancing such as Gerrard, Mascherano (particularly early season) and the fullbacks had shocking seasons in ways that he could not compensate. I still think that injuries and the uncertainty around the club ruined what was an attempted tactical evolution last season.

This is certainty a limitation as a player but my feeling is that like Kuyt in the long run his value will become apparent.

[JohnDoe]

That must be why Roy sees him as captain material, eh?

Pre season is meaningless.

[Vermilion]

Putting in a laughing smiley doesn't pose an argument. Cattermole is a better player than Lucas, simply laughing it off doesn't make it untrue.

Has been known to start a few though.

[Craig_H]

My feeling remains that Lucas is a sort of player that glues a team together and his role is to get the most out of people. I think last season the problem was that the players whose impact he should be enhancing such as Gerrard, Mascherano (particularly early season) and the fullbacks had shocking seasons in ways that he could not compensate. I still think that injuries and the uncertainty around the club ruined what was an attempted tactical evolution last season.

This is certainty a limitation as a player but my feeling is that like Kuyt in the long run his value will become apparent.

Honestly dont understand what leads you to this conclusion. Seems a very random and odd viewpoint.

[danperkins]

Pre season is meaningless.

Yep its just to boost the lads confidence thats all. Suppose the fact that Lucas was brought in for Brazil a 2 or 3 friendlies and one where they have already qualified means that Lucas is obviously good enough to get into the Brazil team in general?

[Mattshark]

Oh yeah good old opta stats, by the so is Diame from Wigan? If your relying on stats to make assumptions about footballers then you got a problem mate.

Lucas is also a very good passer, Diame is not. Also, it was your statement, I was just showing it was false.
If you are relying on just watching them and ignoring stats, you have a problem. Personally I like to use both and not just ignore or attack the ones that don't fit my preconceptions.

Off top of my head Flamini,Parker, and don't mind the expectation, judge the performance as Lucas will be judged on his performance and he most certainly will be judged against players he has replaced, like most other player playing for any other club would be.

Parker has looked good at West Ham and at Charlton, he has done nothing anywhere else, Flamini had one good season at Arsenal.

Well the fact that he failed in the box to box position for Liverpool FC and was put in the DM role and since has become a better player (from your mouth aswell) shows that it is a fact really isn't it?

Opinion is not fact.

Em he does lose the ball, 4 separate occassions in our last game against the mighty Robnikiiikikifii
kkki he lost the ball in silly positions, he gives away silly free kicks in dangerous positions.

Other player lose the ball too, what is your point, Lucas still doesn't give away possession much and doesn't give away a huge amount of fouls.

It very rare you will see Lucas sliding or making the type of challenge Masch does, like i said Lucas is more of the type of player that nicks the ball of people, that was the comparison between styles and not saying that tacklin gon the ground or nicking the ball of doesn't have the same end product.

So, does he have too? As long as he wins the ball that is all that matters. That is purely aesthetics.

And i'm saying that having Lucas in our first team and being the one who is solely responsible for protecting our backline, is and will be detrimental to Liverpool FC IMO.

I disagree (unless we are playing a team of similar stature when 2 DM's should be used).

[danperkins]

Honestly dont understand what leads you to this conclusion. Seems a very random and odd viewpoint.

its very odd

[RedReet]

Pre season is meaningless.

Is the UEFA cup as well?

[Mattshark]

Putting in a laughing smiley doesn't pose an argument. Cattermole is a better player than Lucas, simply laughing it off doesn't make it untrue.

You claiming he is doesn't make it true either.

[RedReet]

Yep its just to boost the lads confidence thats all. Suppose the fact that Lucas was brought in for Brazil a 2 or 3 friendlies and one where they have already qualified means that Lucas is obviously good enough to get into the Brazil team in general?

So why is he the lucky one then?

What a bizarre thing to say.

[JohnDoe]

You claiming he is doesn't make it true either.

Can Lucas do this?

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0gXqU71RZcw"]YouTube- ‪Cattermoleadona‬‎[/ame]

[kris90210]

My feeling remains that Lucas is a sort of player that glues a team together and his role is to get the most out of people. I think last season the problem was that the players whose impact he should be enhancing such as Gerrard, Mascherano (particularly early season) and the fullbacks had shocking seasons in ways that he could not compensate. I still think that injuries and the uncertainty around the club ruined what was an attempted tactical evolution last season.

This is certainty a limitation as a player but my feeling is that like Kuyt in the long run his value will become apparent.

I don't think he enhances Gerrard, Mascherano or any of our other players. Someone like Alonso did because if the opposition gave him space, he would be able to pick his passes, and because he was so accurate teams knew they HAD to close him down. Teams that play against us now, know that they can afford to leave Lucas in possession because he is nowhere near the threat that Alonso was. This leaves less room for Gerrard and our attacking players.

I am backing Lucas this season, but he does need to up his game. We need our first team central midfielders to be world class if we're going to win the league.

Matt, I think it's admirable that you are such an ardent backer of Lucas. I hope that your faith in him is justified this year!

[RedReet]

I have to disagree mate Lucas is more of a DM thats nicks the balls of people more so than a tackler like Masch.

It wasn't a direct comparion of them as such mate, but at the end of the day Lucas is replacing them so "he will" be compared to them and rightly so, Lucas is no where near as good as Masch or Alonso who are completely contrasting holding midfielders, Lucas is the category in between.

And "he is" is failed box to box midfielder, as he wasn't good enough in that position, he was making lots of mistakes so Rafa changed his role, now that mate is a fact, it happened and rafa commented on this himself.

You are obviously a fan of Lucas and thats fair enough, we are all interesting in what is good for LFC, if you think that Lucas in our starting 11 is good for LFC, well i think that is shocking and IMO Lucas in the starting line up is detrimental to our club.

When exactly was this by the way? When were we playing a formation that incorporated a 'box to box' midfielder, or did we change our whole formation to suit this young Brazilian kid?

You gonna answer this for me???

And you seem obsessed with this comment Rafa apparently made about Lucas, but do you remember the one when he came out and said he fails to see how others can’t see just how good a player Lucas actually is? Quite apt at this time, no?