Brendan Rodgers

[danperkins]

http://www.football365.com/f365-says/8335272/Advice365

Super article

[Imy]

And which manager might have accepted that? Rodgers didn't. Would Martinez?

And it wouldn't help us tactically. That's our biggest problem right now imo.

Dunno who would have accepted a role like that, Maybe Martinez, maybe Laudrup - who knows?

For me as a fairly inexperienced manager it's great having a manger i can turn too for help and advice ,a second pair of eyes on problems.

Why can't this be the case in football too? or are managers too egotistical?

An experienced dof (experienced not a wanabee big shot aka Comoli) would have also hopefully helped identify transfer target, called in favours etc, taken some of the pressure off FSG and Rodgers.

[G]

Not only is it acceptable in football its the norm in alot of countries other than England.

As for his role Kenneth , that would be defined by the club and the individual, maybe everything except coach the team, maybe as little as help where ever the manager sees fit, like a Paisley/Dalglish scenario.

We have an inexperienced coach of 39 years of age with little real achievement on his cv determining the entire footballing direction of the club. I'd rather that wasn't the case.

[kingfunk]

Perspective:

We've not finished in the top four for ages. Reality. We ****ed up last summer, and now have to work our way up slowly from where we are. That's reality, that's what teams do. Pretending we have been **** for years? We have been. 2009-2010 - 1 year. 2010-2011 - 2 years. 2011-2012 - 3 years. We are now in our 4th year. That's years mate.

What's happened in that time? Players have aged, players have left, **** has come in, **** has gone out, good players have come in, good players have gone out, youth has been promoted, youth has been sold, the owners have ****ed off, the new owners have come in, we've had four different people manage the club - it's a ridiculous amount of time ago considering what's happened since 2009- and the turbulent nature of our club definitely isn't helping us to improve.

And I'm not talking about you, but since Liverpool have sacked Rafa and Kenny, the fans have tasted blood and are hungry for more, it's splattered all over this thread. I can sort of, even understand that - I can understand that after Kenny and Rafa went that they want other managers to have equally short periods of time (to turn us around)- but that would be cutting off our nose to spite our face- it won't help us. It simply won't help us.

The criticism of Rodgers is beginning to become wildly hilarious now (in a 'I want to headbutt a wall till I pass out' hilarious), and I can only attribute it to frustration at how the team is doing at the moment- which I can also forgive- it's a terrible time to be a supporter (in comparison to our history, we don't support Nottingham Forest, Leeds or Blackburn). But attacking him for acting out his duties in speaking to the press, attacking him for wearing a ****ing scarf, for daring to have a way that he would like us to play? Quoting sentences he has said to the press and taking three words from it and using it to have an attack? Analysing every little last thing he does after a loss to try and get in a few good pops?

Nah I can't have that, it's pathetic in the extreme, I thought we were better than that- and I think it comes from how we reacted to Hodgson and think that's acceptable now- but that man attacked the Kop for daring to fight to protect their club, that man had us sitting on the edge of our box in two banks of four, in front of the ****ing Kop as teams out passed us, out played us, and we showed absolutely nothing to hold onto as a positive. Rodgers has done none of that and is not deserving of the abuse at his door at the moment. Aston Villa result bad, yes- improvement needed - but it's not a weekly occurrence like it is hinted at here.

I'm only 25 for **** sake, but I remember growing up with a culture of backing the team and the manager, and then at the end of the season, taking time to look over all the decisions made, and having the difficult discussions about the manager then (Houllier sticks out)- but allowing him the season to get on with his job without petty sniping or any of that ****e. I've admitted that more recently I've ****ed up on that in recent times in the opening post. I was wrong, it doesn't help anything, only helps perpetuate a negative atmosphere around the club. So I've decided to stop being a bellend and get on with what I was taught by those older with more experience than me to do- and allow the manager to do his job without needless criticism or pressure.

The hypocrisy here is astounding from some people. Brendan said after West Brom, that in improving the team and getting them used to how he wants us to play that we'd have more games like that (a 3-0 loss)- and he was pilloried for saying it- 'our expectations are greater than that, we're Liverpool', 'It's a Hodgson style comment' and 'how dare he profess that as Liverpool's future this season'.

Then, right, get this, when he dares to look up the table, dares to try and show some positivity after getting two back to back wins since 2011 (that's a whole year ago by the way)- he's castigated again. So he came out and made that comment about 2nd, so what? He said let's aim high essentially, he didn't say 'oh well if we beat Aston Villa tomorrow it'll be utopia' he tried to make the team believe that we are capable of dispatching these teams now and that's no bad thing to me and he tried to get some positivity around the club. Could we ****ing score, and have won, perhaps we'd even be discussing climbing the table again. He won't be the first, or the last manager to say something positive in a press conference and have the team lose- it happens even to Ferguson.

I think some of the attacks on Rodgers, aren't through looking realistically at our position, or how we can move forward, but a bitterness at how far we have fallen (not entirely his fault), a bitterness that Rafa and Kenny were let go, bitterness that Everton are doing better than us and a bitterness at watching Man United to continue to rumble on at the top of the league or thereabouts. Bitterness, and it stinks, we'll be laughing at Everton for it with no hint of irony at some point in the future and all.

Anyone would have thought that last summer was the only transfer window we'd ever get to improve the team. That no subsequent windows would be allowed. Unlike Kenny, who was allowed 5 top targets he could go out and purchase whatever the price, Rodgers wasn't allowed this. Period. No argument. We can and I can, argue that he had just two of his own proper signings despite more first team squad players leaving than that! E.g Borini and Allen compared to Carroll, Maxi, Kuyt and Bellamy. So let's be fair in any criticism of Borini/Allen and Rodgers.

His signings were clearly long term based as well, so we need to factor that into our analysis when weighing up how well they have done- and even Borini's barely played- so the criticism on him is baffling. Short term if we wanted instant improvement, should he have gone for players like Borini (21) and Allen (22)? As well as Yesil 18, Assaidi 23 and Sahin on loan at 23?- perhaps not, perhaps it was a mistake- but we'd tried cuppa soup points last season and that failed as well- so what's wrong with trying to build foundations for the future?

So whether he wanted to do it or not, he also had the promotion of Suso/Sterling, both also 18 from the academy to replace seasoned veterans Maxi and Bellamy. Also Wisdom has found himself breaking through into the team. To me it seems that there is pressure from above to start to slowly build the club up again with a collection of players who can grow into their roles- youth essentially- and then have quality added to them.

I can see the criticism of the summer, especially at FSG, but I don't think it's all Rodgers fault, not by a long stretch. I think there was an acceptance from the owners and even from some of us, that perhaps spring boarding straight back into the top four would be difficult especially after the summer prior, so the year zero was put in place- everyone says this year zero always happens but it's the first time I think it has properly happened for me. Big earners were taken off the wage bill, youth was brought in through transfers and promoted up from the academy- we've saved money on wages etc - great. We have tied down Skrtel and Agger to new contracts - great- even Suarez signed a new one- great.

But to judge Rodgers on one overhaul, one big window in the scheme of things is harsh in my book. The window was in some ways different to windows we've had before. Everyone was willing to blame FSG for not backing him in August, it's all Rodgers fault in December.

He needs at least two other windows. He needs at least three other ****ing players. Assuming FSG stay true to their word, we can now look to reinvest the saved wage bill on the right players - these players need to be quality who will slot straight into the first team or the bench to compete with the youth coming through- Sterling shouldn't be starting every game in his first season!

But we collectively need to make sure he gets these players and pressure FSG if he doesn't- that involves backing him unfortunately for some of you. On the other side, in terms of outgoings it looks like Downing has been told he can leave, so that will help us manoeuvre more as well, but it's taking time to get players like him and Joe Cole out of the club- thus not everything can be done in one summer or one window.

18 months. Since when has that been too much to ask? He needs to be allowed to make some adjustments in January and see how we perform after that. Then to make some more adjustments in summer and see how we perform after that - until at least halfway into next season. For me, that's only fair- else we get rid of the end of the season, more millions on compo, then more money on getting players out that the new manager might not fancy, that have just come in - nah it's a never ending cycle of ****e can we not see that now?

We are the epitome of midtable. We are 7 points from THIRD. We are 7 points from the relegation zone, but it's not exactly new under Rodgers. We need consistency. But we are certainly not miles behind where we want to aim for- even after the setback yesterday. There is no denying that reinforcements will help us in January, when you look at the sort of players we play behind Suarez (Enrique, Sterling, Shelvey, Joe Cole) whether the new players are heroes, or just effective players who put the ball in the net- we have to be able to improve on the players who play behind Suarez at the moment and thus must improve our effectiveness as a team- those new players will do better than who we have currently, don't bother arguing against that- but a case can be made for getting the right players in- rather than a stop gap- but then that might put even more pressure on FSG/Rodgers if we do little because the right players aren't available. Think about that.

It hurts right now. We've not been like this for a long time. But Kenny isn't here. Rafa isn't coming back. Capello and (insert whoever else you may have wanted here) wasn't appointed, and I don't think as proud Liverpool fans we'd even want another manager sacked during a season.

Now criticism of his methods, fine, criticism of his line ups and his tactics, fine- all managers make decisions that not everyone agrees with- this happens in football. But talking about getting rid of him already, talking of potential replacements for next season, or constantly reminding people about how you have been proved right with Rodgers (well before the end of the season and even KNOWING he was ****ed over with the Carroll/Dempsey ****) is pathetic.

Oh and that snake oil salesman ****, is hugely disrespectful and can massively **** off as far I'm concerned. I can't believe people are allowed to imply that Rodgers is one big act, going home laughing at how he is Liverpool's manager and we're all falling for how **** he is. I don't believe he has that little ambition and I don't believe he isn't trying his utmost even if it isn't enough at the moment.

Best supporters in the world my arse. He's not walking on his own, but he's walking with a lot less of us than he should be and it'll have an impact on the pitch eventually as well, it always does. Remember that.

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=301075.0

[el matador]

I really hope Rodgers makes it at a field. We need to find more consistency.

[Chazza]

I really hope Rodgers makes it at a field. We need to find more consistency.

Which field?

[Frenchie]

field of dreams..build it and they will come....

[Redspin]

There was plenty to enjoy last season.

Like our worst top flight season in 58 years?

[Baracus]

When its comes to records we've broken a shed load of records over the last 3 years. Impressive....all for the wrong reasons thou.

[Neil Young]

I’d also say Brendan Rodgers must end this nightmare.

Almost this easy: bin Gerrard and then sign der Smudo.

[Vermilion]

@kingfunk. Some very good points well made.

[BobTheCharmer]

Like our worst top flight season in 58 years?

redspin predictable as ever. yes I enjoyed it all immensley. looks like this season could be better worse

[Glenn Hysen]

Great post Kingfunk.

[Daniel 7]

I'm sick of this

"The worst x y or z in however many years"

What the **** does it matter?

[Kenneth]

Dunno who would have accepted a role like that, Maybe Martinez, maybe Laudrup - who knows?

For me as a fairly inexperienced manager it's great having a manger i can turn too for help and advice ,a second pair of eyes on problems.

Why can't this be the case in football too? or are managers too egotistical?

An experienced dof (experienced not a wanabee big shot aka Comoli) would have also hopefully helped identify transfer target, called in favours etc, taken some of the pressure off FSG and Rodgers.

All waffle. Help and advice, second pair of eyes, identify targets, call in favours, taken pressure off... They sound like the roles opf assiatant manager, scout and wibble.

Maybe it would have helped in ways we can't know from outside the organisation, but people suggesting things would better are just guessing. Who knows, maybe it would have been worse. It's hyperthetcial and pointless.